Roundtable discussion for 5AF NHL Awards Ballots - RESULTS ARE IN...

[mikey]

I have a hard time handing the Selke to a winger for some reason.

It can be tough to justify sometimes certainly. But exceptions do happen. Kurri taking "center responsibilities" for Gretzky, Dupuis for Crosby, sometimes you see it with Palat for Stamkos...but yeah, it's traditionally a center award for good reason...

[MR25]

I think I forgot that Patrice Bergeron existed.

[meow]

I think I forgot that Patrice Bergeron existed.

Bergeron is a weird case. He had his great rookie season, then plateaued a bit. Then he became so underrated that he eventually became overrated. Now, he's back to being underrated a bit.

[Staggy]

Wyshinski was on the BS Report yesterday and mentioned that Bergeron was a top 5 player in the league Surprisingly, that is not the podcast to listen to if you want any sort of intelligent hockey talk.

[mikey]

See, the thing is that if you take that stance you have to be consistent with it...ok, Bergeron is a top five player in the league because you really value two-way play...so that means now that the guys that bring offense and also two-way play also have to be pretty high...for instance, that would make guys like Jamie Benn, Nicklas Backstrom, Joe Pavelski, Ryan Getzlaf the other guys in the top five...? Or Jonathan Toews is up there, even Claude Giroux is way up there, Henrik Zetterberg, Pavel Datsyuk, Anze Kopitar...when you go down that road and you really go down it and not just spout off things at random, you have a top-10 that might not include Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin, Stamkos, Tavares, Seguin, Kane, etc. and then you have to do that with defensemen too...it's a tough way to go about it if it's an honest opinion...

[Staggy]

That was part of the thing that always bothered me with Toews being listed as a top 3 player in GM polls or whatever. Really, looking at the two of them, what is the difference between him and Kopitar? Toews is probably slightly better on defense, while Kopitar is a bit better on offense. But they're production is so similar, both even have nearly identical playoff resumes. Then there's the whole other level of Selke play that Datsyuk and Z reached 6 or 7 years ago and I don't remember either of them even getting the attention that Toews has.

And I don't mean to get on Wysh too much for that statement. He mentioned it in passing in a very casual setting, pointing out how ridiculous it was for Bergeron to be getting only the fourth most ice time among Bruins' forwards. But still, you can make the point without being quite that hyperbolic.

[mikey]

I mean, Wysh is a clown...so clowns tend to make foolish statements...he's there to entertain not inform...

I'm a history nut when it comes to hockey and the same things come up. "I think Ron Francis belongs here because of his two-way play and faceoff abilities..." well, that's nice and all, but let's not forget that he's not the only player that played good defense and took key faceoffs...you still have to account for Messier, Clarke, Keon, etc. now, you might loft him over some offense-only players by making a statement like that, but now you've introduced a whole new subset of players based on your own criteria...you can't just talk-and-cut your way to the front of the buffet line...

[MalkinIsMyHomeboy]

Wyshinski was on the BS Report yesterday and mentioned that Bergeron was a top 5 player in the league Surprisingly, that is not the podcast to listen to if you want any sort of intelligent hockey talk.

I listened to that today and said out loud "what the hell" when I heard that

I really like Bergeron but in no way is he top 5.

[mikey]

Last call today. Get those last minute ballots in, I still don't feel we have a strong enough sample size...

[meow]

I could ask mrs. meow to cast a ballot. Although, I think she'd vote in Keith Yandle for every award.

[relantel]

Last call today. Get those last minute ballots in, I still don't feel we have a strong enough sample size...

Mikey:
Might be able to complete something by 7. Did not get a shot last night.

PS- is there a link out there as to who each of the 30 teams named their own team MVP? (out of curiosity more than voting research TBH)

[mikey]

That's fine. And, I'm not aware of a comprehensive list for that.

[relantel]

That's fine. And, I'm not aware of a comprehensive list for that.

thanks - and maybe I'll compile from team sites & post here the results.

[mikey]

I'm tallying up the votes now, absolute last call...need it in like ten minutes if you got it...turn out was very poor unfortunately...so not much may be gleaned anyhow...

[relantel]

mikey, sorry I could not complete one. Ran out of time (and not enough time at work to waste to do it either with cramming for being off tomorrow.

[mikey]

No sweat, relantel. Results to be posted shortly.

[mikey]

[mikey]

[mikey]

[mikey]

[mikey]

[mikey]

[mikey]

[shafnutz05]

Thanks so much for doing this Mikey!! Hopefully by this time next year, we'll have gained a larger following and will have a bigger sample size to work with. Great work.

[meow]

meow's ballot for transparency:

Hart Memorial Trophy
1. Price
2. Tavares
3. Crosby
4. Ovechkin
5. R. Nash

James Norris Memorial Trophy
1. Letang
2. Karlsson
3. Josi
4. Subban
5. Doughty

Georges Vezina Trophy
1. Price
2. Rinne
3. Holtby

Calder Memorial Trophy
1. Stone
2. Gaudreau
3. Forsberg
4. Ekblad
5. Klingberg

Frank J Selke Trophy
1. Toews
2. Bergeron
3. Kopitar
4. Kesler
5. Pavelski

Lady Byng Memorial Trophy:
1. Hudler
2. Datsyuk
3. Couture
4. Moulson
5. B. Richards

Jack Adams Trophy
1. Trotz
2. Capuano
3. Yeo

General Manager of the Year
1. Fletcher
2. Cheveldayoff
3. Bob Murray

All Star Teams:
1st Team
Ovechkin - Crosby - Tarasenko
Letang - Josi
Price

2nd Team
Benn - Tavares - Voracek
Subban - Karlsson
Rinne

3rd Team
Pacioretty - Seguin - Stone
Burns - Carlson
Dubnyk