Politics And Current Events

[dodint]

Just for the thought exercise of it...did the first school kids bootstrap themselves? Parents probably paid, huh? My parents paid. Now I'm paying for other people's kids only. But that's not good enough, you want a little more, right?

Parents acting like society not only doesn't cater to them enough but also that they're entitled to even more is truly maddening.

[shmenguin]

And faftorial’s experience of old timey child raising did not include spending 20k a year on child care for one kid, in an urban area. With the alternative being dumping them into a toddler farm where they learn how to be attention seeking maniacs.

That because my ex stayed home with the kids and we sacrificed elsewhere.

Correct. The women not working actually does solve this. But it’s another old timey faftorial thing that hasn’t caught up to today.

[shmenguin]

There is a middle ground between letting the species die out and having to fund folks because, apparently, they had a child they were unable to afford...at least, I would think...

I think what people aren’t understanding in this thread is that it’s a problem that a significant portion of Americans can’t afford to have a child - even if they are educated and employed. Do you understand how much child care costs?

You and the others who have had no inclination to breed saying “well don’t have kids then”…that’s your point. That it should be reserved for upper echelon income and that poor and “middle class” people should just ride it out childless.

[count2infinity]

I had a kid and still haven't received my entitlement trophy yet... when does that get mailed to me?

[Morkle]

Just for the thought exercise of it...did the first school kids bootstrap themselves? Parents probably paid, huh? My parents paid. Now I'm paying for other people's kids only. But that's not good enough, you want a little more, right?

Parents acting like society not only doesn't cater to them enough but also that they're entitled to even more is truly maddening.

Well wait a second, are we talking about the folks here in this message board? Or the parents who are financially struggling for whatever reason?

As a parent, we're all financially struggling in some way, but we made the choice. I don't need or want help, but I recognize that's not the case for every parent.

I will also say, I'd rather work to enable the kids to be successful than dumping them on the street if funding is the issue - because it perpetuates those issues down the line.

[Morkle]

I had a kid and still haven't received my entitlement trophy yet... when does that get mailed to me?

I got like $100 Biden bucks last Friday, so I think that's the option instead of a trophy.

[CBear3]

There is a middle ground between letting the species die out and having to fund folks because, apparently, they had a child they were unable to afford...at least, I would think...

Yes, we should only let Jeff Bezos and people living in shanties to procreate. That's a future society I'm sure you'll want to experience when you're 75.

dodint is right, that if it's too expensive we need to adjust all the other causes rather than slapping a band-aid on it by throwing money to people. But we don't have a functioning government to discuss this, and society follows suit.

The alternative is to do it the way the greatest generation did with a parent staying at home; that'll only cripple the labor market more and watch the recession that takes place with the reduced resources and labor force.

[faftorial]

Just for the thought exercise of it...did the first school kids bootstrap themselves? Parents probably paid, huh? My parents paid. Now I'm paying for other people's kids only. But that's not good enough, you want a little more, right?

Parents acting like society not only doesn't cater to them enough but also that they're entitled to even more is truly maddening.

Well wait a second, are we talking about the folks here in this message board? Or the parents who are financially struggling for whatever reason?

As a parent, we're all financially struggling in some way, but we made the choice. I don't need or want help, but I recognize that's not the case for every parent.

I will also say, I'd rather work to enable the kids to be successful than dumping them on the street if funding is the issue - because it perpetuates those issues down the line.

I think the original question was when does this new benefit cut off? I don't think we should be subsidizing children even more than we do now for high earning families like shmenguin's.

[dodint]

Just for the thought exercise of it...did the first school kids bootstrap themselves? Parents probably paid, huh? My parents paid. Now I'm paying for other people's kids only. But that's not good enough, you want a little more, right?

Parents acting like society not only doesn't cater to them enough but also that they're entitled to even more is truly maddening.

Well wait a second, are we talking about the folks here in this message board? Or the parents who are financially struggling for whatever reason?

As a parent, we're all financially struggling in some way, but we made the choice. I don't need or want help, but I recognize that's not the case for every parent.

I will also say, I'd rather work to enable the kids to be successful than dumping them on the street if funding is the issue - because it perpetuates those issues down the line.

This discussion kicked off because a childfree person said it might be prudent to allow for a cap on free kid money. Seems reasonable to me. Seems unreasonable to someone else.

I wasn't directly involved in that exchange. My 'emperor for a day' plan is UBI in place of all entitlements. Failing that, I think it should be acknowledged that if you choose to have kids you're signing up for a difficult job. shmenguin thinks that's also my job as well. No thanks, I say. I don't think you're special for having a kid, particularly one you can't afford. I'd rather my tax dollars take care of everyone in a uniform way.

[Morkle]

I don't see why there wouldn't be a cap to getting childcare costs. I get a check every month or something from that new deal, and it doesn't really do anything for me personally. Meaning I don't rely on it at all for childcare.

I don't think every family really should be entitled to that money, sure.

[count2infinity]

I had a kid and still haven't received my entitlement trophy yet... when does that get mailed to me?

I got like $100 Biden bucks last Friday, so I think that's the option instead of a trophy.

I'm supposed to take that money and buy my own trophy?!?!? wtf...

[MrKennethTKangaroo]

This child tax credit is just crappy messaging. It has been around for many, many moons. Families didn't notice it as much when it just was another line item on your tax return that resulted in paying less income tax. The biden administration decided to increase it by $1,000 per kid (and $1,600 for kids under 3 or whatever). They also came up with this hairbrained idea to send checks every month to brand it as a way to help cover child care costs. It is no different than these cities that are "testing" UBI by getting money from foundations and then giving people $500 a month or whatever. That isn't ubi. its charity. Biden's plan isn't anything that hasn't been done for 20 years or so. its just a larger dollar amount. I think under trump it was $2,000 per kid.


The reality of the math of the current biden policy is this: If you have a married coulple with two kids over the age of three, you don't pay tax on the first $80,000 of income you make, give or take a few bucks. If you make less than $80,000, not only do you not owe tax, but you get a few bucks for having kids. is that right or wrong? I dont know. does it make a difference in peoples lives? Sure. do they realize it? I dont know. what i do know is that i get annoyed when things that have been around for a long time get rebranded under the name of progressive policy.

[shmenguin]

Just for the thought exercise of it...did the first school kids bootstrap themselves? Parents probably paid, huh? My parents paid. Now I'm paying for other people's kids only. But that's not good enough, you want a little more, right?

Parents acting like society not only doesn't cater to them enough but also that they're entitled to even more is truly maddening.

Well wait a second, are we talking about the folks here in this message board? Or the parents who are financially struggling for whatever reason?

As a parent, we're all financially struggling in some way, but we made the choice. I don't need or want help, but I recognize that's not the case for every parent.

I will also say, I'd rather work to enable the kids to be successful than dumping them on the street if funding is the issue - because it perpetuates those issues down the line.

This discussion kicked off because a childfree person said it might be prudent to allow for a cap on free kid money. Seems reasonable to me. Seems unreasonable to someone else.

I wasn't directly involved in that exchange. My 'emperor for a day' plan is UBI in place of all entitlements. Failing that, I think it should be acknowledged that if you choose to have kids you're signing up for a difficult job. shmenguin thinks that's also my job as well. No thanks, I say. I don't think you're special for having a kid, particularly one you can't afford. I'd rather my tax dollars take care of everyone in a uniform way.

It kicked off because people without kids don’t know how much childcare costs and some weird theory that “average income” means you can afford necessities- which has no underlying economic backing.

Are we canceling the “you can’t talk about gun control because you don’t own guns and are uninformed about them” rhetoric now that the peanut gallery is chiming in about the experience of being a parent?

[dodint]

It's very narrow-minded to assume that I don't have children in my life. I bet I deal more with children than you do with guns.

[eddy]

You know something isn't working how it should when it makes more sense for my wife to just not work while the kids were younger versus work and paying for child care.

[faftorial]

You know something isn't working how it should when it makes more sense for my wife to just not work while the kids were younger versus work and paying for child care.

You guys are old timey too?

[eddy]

You know something isn't working how it should when it makes more sense for my wife to just not work while the kids were younger versus work and paying for child care.

You guys are old timey too?

I had my first kid at 26, wife was 24;if that's what you mean? I'm 40 now.

[shmenguin]

It's very narrow-minded to assume that I don't have children in my life. I bet I deal more with children than you do with guns.

Ok. Detail out the schematics of parenting then. Being cool uncle dodint and hearing 2nd hand accounts from friends and family is what we all used to be before we bred. We knew what it’s like to “deal with children”. And then we had children and realized we didn’t know anything. What an interesting attempt at establishing credentials.

[NAN]

If we had someone stay home in my family to raise the kids, it would be me as my wife out earns me.

[shmenguin]

You know something isn't working how it should when it makes more sense for my wife to just not work while the kids were younger versus work and paying for child care.

You guys are old timey too?

Moms staying home to raise kids is…contemporary?

[nocera]

Call me old-fashioned, but I still believe there is only one true God. And he lives in this lake. And his name is Zorgo.

[dodint]

It's very narrow-minded to assume that I don't have children in my life. I bet I deal more with children than you do with guns.

Ok. Detail out the schematics of parenting then. Being cool uncle dodint and hearing 2nd hand accounts from friends and family is what we all used to be before we bred. We knew what it’s like to “deal with children”. And then we had children and realized we didn’t know anything. What an interesting attempt at establishing credentials.

It would be silly to say that I know what it's like to be a parent. It's also ignorant to say that I have no concept of what parenting is. You compared it to someone that is anti-gun who has no practical experience with handling firearms. That's a very weak comparison.

I only bother to acknowledge the absurdity of it because there is a popular conception that DINK/Childfree people just wander through life from one leisure spot to the next. As if we don't have similar struggles and pressures. We're labeled as selfish because we don't want to contribute to the kids you had but can't afford; amazing. All of society is canted towards making sure you have what you need and you're pissed the silver platter isn't buffed to a high enough shine.

[NAN]

This child tax credit is just crappy messaging. It has been around for many, many moons. Families didn't notice it as much when it just was another line item on your tax return that resulted in paying less income tax. The biden administration decided to increase it by $1,000 per kid (and $1,600 for kids under 3 or whatever). They also came up with this hairbrained idea to send checks every month to brand it as a way to help cover child care costs. It is no different than these cities that are "testing" UBI by getting money from foundations and then giving people $500 a month or whatever. That isn't ubi. its charity. Biden's plan isn't anything that hasn't been done for 20 years or so. its just a larger dollar amount. I think under trump it was $2,000 per kid.


The reality of the math of the current biden policy is this: If you have a married coulple with two kids over the age of three, you don't pay tax on the first $80,000 of income you make, give or take a few bucks. If you make less than $80,000, not only do you not owe tax, but you get a few bucks for having kids. is that right or wrong? I dont know. does it make a difference in peoples lives? Sure. do they realize it? I dont know. what i do know is that i get annoyed when things that have been around for a long time get rebranded under the name of progressive policy.

People are going to **** when they find out their tax refund isn't as high.

[faftorial]

You know something isn't working how it should when it makes more sense for my wife to just not work while the kids were younger versus work and paying for child care.

You guys are old timey too?

Moms staying home to raise kids is…contemporary?

I didn't say it was but my life is not guided by what "most people do."

[dodint]

People are going to **** when they find out their tax refund isn't as high.

I've been wondering about that.