That’s what we like to call in the business an ‘establishing’ shot.lol the ones from the doc are old chain nets that they’ve replaced with nylon and they took the rims down now because of COVIDGet some new nets in there
what’s funny is that this court is only like 2 years old so Jordan never could’ve played on it
NBA
-
- Posts: 11569
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:04 pm
- Location: Orlando, FL
NBA
-
- Posts: 19757
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:33 pm
- Location: Iodine State
NBA
But they could’ve shot a basketball court anywhere for those shots, and went all the way to Wilmington to do that. Pretty cool.
I knew Jordan was a competitor, but he still gets fired up TO THIS DAY about the Pistons no handshakes at the end of that series.
Horace Grant looks like he’s 35.
I knew Jordan was a competitor, but he still gets fired up TO THIS DAY about the Pistons no handshakes at the end of that series.
Horace Grant looks like he’s 35.
-
- Posts: 7151
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 5:24 pm
- Location: "Hey, who needs hockey? Didn't the Steelers just win the Super Bowl?"
- Contact:
NBA
I never realized how much MJ disliked Zeke. Like I knew that Jordan supposedly had a hand in keeping him off one of the olympic teams, but hearing him last night at the mere mention of Thomas' name, you could tell there is legit dislike.
NBA
If you'd like a salty read from the Detroit Free Press, here you go: Don't let 'The Last Dance' make you forget how beautiful the 'Bad Boys' Pistons could be
They were beautiful to watch. Though I doubt you’ll see that Sunday night when ESPN's “The Last Dance” details Michael Jordan and the Chicago Bulls’ effort to overcome the Bad Boys.
Some narratives are too hard to overcome; the mythology was set long ago.
-
- Posts: 28164
- Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:12 pm
- Location: Methuselah Honeysuckle
NBA
The Bad Boys Pistons = The Trapping Devils. They won, but it sucked.
NBA
Lebron in the 90s would have decimated everyone, but I think would have had issues not being treated the way he is today with fouls.
Jordan in the now, would decimate everyone based on being given everything.
Two different players, two different times, both generational. MJ still better, if you consider championships, imo.
Jordan in the now, would decimate everyone based on being given everything.
Two different players, two different times, both generational. MJ still better, if you consider championships, imo.
-
- Posts: 7077
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:43 pm
- Location: Those who don't listen will eventually be surrounded by people with nothing to say
NBA
the championship debate is a stupid measuring stick in this debate. this is strictly speaking for cleveland lebron - miami and LAL are different stories - MJ had pipped and most of rodman and dont forget ron harper (MACtion)
lebron took a team of booby gibson, eric snow, sasha pavlocic, drew goodin, and zydronis ilguskas to the finals. TO THE FINALS!!! and mike brown as coach? ROFLCOPTER. The talent lebron had around pre-miami is a freaking laugh riot.
miami lebron is a good comparison of MJ
MJ -- Lebron
pippen -- wade
kerr - ray allen
also to note - the GSW rosters that lebron faced are nothing like MJ ever saw
this is not an opinion on MJ v LBJ but rather that we need to recalibrate our evaluation tool
lebron took a team of booby gibson, eric snow, sasha pavlocic, drew goodin, and zydronis ilguskas to the finals. TO THE FINALS!!! and mike brown as coach? ROFLCOPTER. The talent lebron had around pre-miami is a freaking laugh riot.
miami lebron is a good comparison of MJ
MJ -- Lebron
pippen -- wade
kerr - ray allen
also to note - the GSW rosters that lebron faced are nothing like MJ ever saw
this is not an opinion on MJ v LBJ but rather that we need to recalibrate our evaluation tool
NBA
No doubt Jordan had more help than early Lebron. He also played in a tougher conference though.
Lebron was more well equipped to deal with a physical team than Jordan. However, I wonder how he would have dealt with that abuse earlier in his career, especially if he wasn’t getting the calls. Jordan always seemed to have a mental toughness. Lebron seemed to grow into that.
Lebron was more well equipped to deal with a physical team than Jordan. However, I wonder how he would have dealt with that abuse earlier in his career, especially if he wasn’t getting the calls. Jordan always seemed to have a mental toughness. Lebron seemed to grow into that.
-
- Posts: 29481
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:45 pm
- Location: “MIMH is almost always correct” -ulf
NBA
really the only argument I have right now that "MJ > Lebron" is 6 > 3. It's an arbitrary measure, yeah, but it's nigh impossible to make other comparisons. There are so many variables like teammates, coaches, style of play in the era, greatness of other teams in the era, etc
NBA
I don't think there were many players with the size to actually abuse LeBron enough to bother him enough to impact anythingNo doubt Jordan had more help than early Lebron. He also played in a tougher conference though.
Lebron was more well equipped to deal with a physical team than Jordan. However, I wonder how he would have dealt with that abuse earlier in his career, especially if he wasn’t getting the calls. Jordan always seemed to have a mental toughness. Lebron seemed to grow into that.
-
- Posts: 29481
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:45 pm
- Location: “MIMH is almost always correct” -ulf
NBA
that's a tough way to compare though because they do different things. Jordan was a better pure scorer than Lebron, Lebron is a better facilitatorI mean, watching them play is a decent metric. Not to take anything away from Lebron, but if I was starting a team, I’d take Jordan first.
like in the doc they talked about how Phil had to convince MJ to pass to Paxson in the NBA finals to beat the Lakers. That stuff all came naturally to Lebron
NBA
I laughed at that sequence because I remember LeBron passing up a game winning shot or two early in his career and the narrative was that he didn't have a killer instinct to shoot the dagger like MJ did
NBA
I was meaning the Pistons specifically. Mahorn and Laimbeer were both pretty big. And Mahorn at least, was pretty built. And both were dirty af.I don't think there were many players with the size to actually abuse LeBron enough to bother him enough to impact anythingNo doubt Jordan had more help than early Lebron. He also played in a tougher conference though.
Lebron was more well equipped to deal with a physical team than Jordan. However, I wonder how he would have dealt with that abuse earlier in his career, especially if he wasn’t getting the calls. Jordan always seemed to have a mental toughness. Lebron seemed to grow into that.
NBA
Plus the way the Pistons played wasn't just physical, they tried to hurt players by shoving in the back, etc.I was meaning the Pistons specifically. Mahorn and Laimbeer were both pretty big. And Mahorn at least, was pretty built. And both were dirty af.I don't think there were many players with the size to actually abuse LeBron enough to bother him enough to impact anythingNo doubt Jordan had more help than early Lebron. He also played in a tougher conference though.
Lebron was more well equipped to deal with a physical team than Jordan. However, I wonder how he would have dealt with that abuse earlier in his career, especially if he wasn’t getting the calls. Jordan always seemed to have a mental toughness. Lebron seemed to grow into that.
NBA
I agree they’re different players who bring different things. But looking at the overall package of things they did, Jordan did more, IMO. Bill Simmons has been doing a rewatchaBulls podcast going through some of their playoff games. Against the Knicks in 93 they played a full court trap all game. I went back and rewatched. It was incredible to see the amount of effort he put out on defense, and then still scored 54.that's a tough way to compare though because they do different things. Jordan was a better pure scorer than Lebron, Lebron is a better facilitatorI mean, watching them play is a decent metric. Not to take anything away from Lebron, but if I was starting a team, I’d take Jordan first.
like in the doc they talked about how Phil had to convince MJ to pass to Paxson in the NBA finals to beat the Lakers. That stuff all came naturally to Lebron
NBA
You forgot Adrian Dantley and John Salley. I hated that team along with the coach, Chuck Daly.I was meaning the Pistons specifically. Mahorn and Laimbeer were both pretty big. And Mahorn at least, was pretty built. And both were dirty af.I don't think there were many players with the size to actually abuse LeBron enough to bother him enough to impact anythingNo doubt Jordan had more help than early Lebron. He also played in a tougher conference though.
Lebron was more well equipped to deal with a physical team than Jordan. However, I wonder how he would have dealt with that abuse earlier in his career, especially if he wasn’t getting the calls. Jordan always seemed to have a mental toughness. Lebron seemed to grow into that.
-
- Posts: 11569
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:04 pm
- Location: Orlando, FL
NBA
I think Jordan vs LeBron is a bit apples and oranges because they're two different body types working in two different eras with pretty different rules as far as freedom of movement and what defenses are allowed. Where I think the differentiation comes into play is how strong the opposition was during each's era. When Jordan's Bulls were first making their playoff runs where MJ was the full focal point of the offense, they first had to deal with the back end of the Celtics 80's run in the East followed by the Pistons beating them to hell as the decade turned. You compare that to LeBron's first run with the Cavs, he's the focal point of the offense and they get a weak draw to the finals in 07 only having to deal with the back end of the Ben Wallace/Chauncey Billups muck-it-up Pistons run. But over the next 3 years, they couldn't get over the hump because they'd run into the Paul Pierce Celtics and the Jameer Nelson Magic. So, the advantage there would probably lean LeBron simply because he got to a Finals.
Now let's move to the dominant eras. Jordan's championship runs had to go thru those Pistons who they could never beat but also Barkley's Sixers (with Mahorn on the team too) that always gave them trouble as well as the Ewing/Oakley Knicks, the Cavs who had Price, Nance, and Daugherty, and then at the very end, Reggie and the Pacers had strengthened enough to be a big threat (they really should have won Game 7 in that 98 ECF). I'd argue that the Bulls did have it pretty easy in the East in 96 and 97 but 4 out of those 6 titles certainly had difficult runs somewhere in the East. As for LeBron, when he went to the Heat, there wasn't much to talk about in the East. There was the back end of the Pierce-Allen-KG Celtics and that was about it. Granted, that Heat team was pretty damn loaded but there just wasn't any sort of competition to give them a little pain in their runs to the Finals. When LeBron goes to the Cavs, same thing. The East is incredibly weak and his roster is plenty strong enough that it doesn't take much to get to the Finals. Hell, the one year, they may as well have just played Golden State-Cleveland the week after the regular season ended and not go through the process of getting to that inevitable end. But here's the telling part -- Jordan's teams were 6 for 6 when they got to the Finals in large part, I think, because of the competition they dealt with leading into those Finals. LeBron's teams from 2010-11 to 2017-18 made 8 straight Finals but only won 3 of them. A lack of a test or two going into that, I think, is a good reason. As good as those Miami teams were, they should have won all 4 years he was there and yet, it took a Ray Allen 3 late in regulation in Game 6 in to keep them from LOSING 3 out of 4 years. Advantage -- overwhelmingly on Jordan's side.
Now let's move to the dominant eras. Jordan's championship runs had to go thru those Pistons who they could never beat but also Barkley's Sixers (with Mahorn on the team too) that always gave them trouble as well as the Ewing/Oakley Knicks, the Cavs who had Price, Nance, and Daugherty, and then at the very end, Reggie and the Pacers had strengthened enough to be a big threat (they really should have won Game 7 in that 98 ECF). I'd argue that the Bulls did have it pretty easy in the East in 96 and 97 but 4 out of those 6 titles certainly had difficult runs somewhere in the East. As for LeBron, when he went to the Heat, there wasn't much to talk about in the East. There was the back end of the Pierce-Allen-KG Celtics and that was about it. Granted, that Heat team was pretty damn loaded but there just wasn't any sort of competition to give them a little pain in their runs to the Finals. When LeBron goes to the Cavs, same thing. The East is incredibly weak and his roster is plenty strong enough that it doesn't take much to get to the Finals. Hell, the one year, they may as well have just played Golden State-Cleveland the week after the regular season ended and not go through the process of getting to that inevitable end. But here's the telling part -- Jordan's teams were 6 for 6 when they got to the Finals in large part, I think, because of the competition they dealt with leading into those Finals. LeBron's teams from 2010-11 to 2017-18 made 8 straight Finals but only won 3 of them. A lack of a test or two going into that, I think, is a good reason. As good as those Miami teams were, they should have won all 4 years he was there and yet, it took a Ray Allen 3 late in regulation in Game 6 in to keep them from LOSING 3 out of 4 years. Advantage -- overwhelmingly on Jordan's side.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: Dickie Dunn, faftorial, Orlando Penguin, Pavel Bure and 136 guests