HOF - yes or no?

HOF - yes or no?

Jarome Iginla
14
23%
Daniel Alfredsson
7
11%
Tom Barrasso
3
5%
Theo Fleury
4
7%
Sergei Gonchar
6
10%
Marian Hossa
9
15%
Kevin Lowe
2
3%
Alex Mogilny
5
8%
Keith Tkachuk
2
3%
Patrik Elias
0
No votes
Rod Brind'Amour
3
5%
Jeremy Roenick
4
7%
Pierre Turgeon
0
No votes
Curtis Joseph
2
3%
 
Total votes: 61
Gaucho
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Gaucho » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:00 pm

Thought Kevin Lowe was already in...

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Gaucho » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:01 pm

Iginla is an obvious choice, and so is Hossa imo.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby meow » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:22 pm

Gimme Tommy B, Theo and Hossa

The rest can get bent

MR25
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby MR25 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:39 pm

I'd be interested to see if a conversation shifts for Rod Brindamour if his coaching career becomes really successful.

He seems to be doing a good job this early into it.

Having trouble coming up with a coach in recent memory who scored 1000+ points and won a Cup as a player and also had a Cup win as a coach. Could just be my memory though.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Dickie Dunn » Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:27 pm

Alfredsson can eat a dick.

Pavel Bure
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Pavel Bure » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:59 pm

Alfredsson can eat a dick.
This, he should probably get in one day but that slap shot at Niedermayer really soured me on him.

King Colby
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby King Colby » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:38 pm

Man... i could argue for none. All of them have flawed resumes in one way or another which im guessing this why they're on here.

Ultimately, I went with Iginla and Mogilny, mostly because they were trailblazers for black players and Russians, respectively.

I could be convinced on Turgeon and Cujo.
Last edited by King Colby on Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Faftorial
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Faftorial » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:40 pm

Hossa and Iginla

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Faftorial » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:41 pm

Jeremy Roenick shouldn't be considered unless someone here wants to make that argument.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Faftorial » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:43 pm

Tkachuk too. And some others.

King Colby
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby King Colby » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:47 pm

Barrasso, fleury, alfredsson, Tkachuk, brind'amour, and roenick are all definite Nos for me.

Gonchar, elias probably not.

Lowe, Hossa, maybe.

Turgeon and cujo you can convince me.

Mogilny probably.

Iginla yes.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby King Colby » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:48 pm

zubov got in. I'd love to see gonchar get in. He will not.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby mikey » Mon Jun 22, 2020 10:49 pm

Pretty slim pickens here given the criteria, but not a lot of crazy names, which is nice...I'll talk at some leisure about them, if I may...

Iginla - Absolute lock. He'll go in the minute he's eligible, which I think this one coming up. He had some rough line and teammates over the years and still produced big time in the DPE. Hart Trophy and two goal-scoring wins. First-Team All-Star 3x, but on both sides of the lockout. Showed adaptability. 2002-2012 prime is really strong for a winger. Has a signature playoff run and moment. Has an Olympic gold medal moment to boot. Probably the lone realistic candidate for being a top-100 player in the history of the game (maybe Hossa). Power forward. Great guy.

Alfredsson - Close. Didn't get vote from me. But he was one of them that I thought really hard about (Elias and Turgeon were the others that also didn't get one...when I hit submit, I regretted no Turgeon immediately). Didn't quite have the elite peak offensively, even with the big seasons with the Pizza Line. But the two-way play was there. He brought it. Has a signature playoff run and an "on the map" run in 2002. Big part of the 2006 Swedish gold medal team. Has some questionable sportsmanship moments, lacks a lot of playoff sucess overall, like I said before, lacks a real elite time, was never a serious MVP candidate (finished a distant 5th once in 2006, in a year dominated by Jags, Jumbo, and Kipper).

Barrasso - Came in hot into a weaker league and dominated as a teenager from a U.S. high school. The bulk of his peak seasons happening before the age of 22 as a goalie is probably a red flag. But then he has the '92 playoff run, the '93 season, a resurgence behind the drill instructor Constantine in '98 before losing it. Strong puck player. Very hot and cold. Not well liked by the people who also vote on these things obviously. Has two of the bigger upsets in modern playoff history hung around his neck. Tough to make a case that he's a top-30 goalie of all-time, and there's only about that many in. What does he really have on Fleury? Vanbiesbrouck? CuJo?

Fleury - One of my few "yes" votes on the board. Little guy who played with a lot of courage in an era where this kind of player rarely made it. Has 3 each of the top-10 finishes in goals and points and they span a decade. Career is bookmarked by the '89 Cup and the '02 gold medal. In the middle though, he is marred by playoff disappointments, many can't be hung on him directly, but he also couldn't escape them. Continued to be productive across two distinct eras. Dealt with obvious issues throughout his playing career and some hold that against him, some hold it as a positive for him. Had a penchant for some unsportsmanlike play at times.

Gonchar - Had some fun offensive totals and a stretch of decent Norris consideration in the early 2000's and then again in his second and third seasons in Pittsburgh where his game matured significantly. Went from defensive mess, to strong #1 d-man. Had a penchant for defensive miscues and soft play on competitive teams. More of a Hall of Very Good type...was he really better than Sergei Zubov? I think he's a small-ish step down and Zubov was a borderline case at best probably. Is he better than Eric Desjardins? Maybe offensively by a tier, but worse defensively over his career by more. I'll pass.

Hossa - I mean, come on, what can you say. What a career. Elite two-way winger. Production, defensive play, the whole bit...success followed him around...had deep runs with Ottawa (deserved better, but Lalime), Pittsburgh, Detroit, Chicago...he should have been about a 6x or 7x Finalist. Still has 3 Cups. 4x Olympian on no-chance teams (he played on the World Championships team as a teenager, would have been a viable guy to play in 5). This is the only other player that has a legitimate claim in the direction of being a top-100 player of all-time (Iginla is the other). I don't think he's there (100) but he's a dunk for the HOF for me.

Lowe - I don't mean to be too simplistic, but if Kevin Lowe played for the Jets, he's not on the table. He got some scant Norris voting here and there because he was in the vicinity of playing with Paul Coffey (and a couple after him, to be fair). There was a push for more defensive guys in Norris voting in the 80s as a push back for mistakes based on numbers (Carlyle) and Lowe got swept into that. He was a very useful player on those Oilers dynasties and he deserves credit for that. That credit comes in the form of rings and not HOF busts.

Mogilny - Maybe the most technically skilled player on the board, but just didn't put together enough consistency to be in this conversation. Whether it was being hurt or just his role as a mercenary, this just isn't a match. Was voted top-5 at hs position twice in his career, received one 4th place and one 5th place vote for MVP in his whole career, only has two somewhat noteworthy playoff performances and one of them ended very quickly. Other than some more games, what does he really have on Ziggy Palffy? Probably nothing. On Naslund? Almost certainly nothing.

Tkachuk - Power forward extraordinaire. Yeah, he could basically just do whatever in the DPE, which says a lot. I always sell him short for some reason...which is weird, because I owned a Coyotes jersey of his for a good chunk of my life. Obviously, playoffs were just a big bugaboo for him...Olympics too. I don't know what it was, but it just seemed like he could be stopped in situations where he should have thrived. He has a case for sure, he was better than we remember probably. He's legitimately 100x better than Andreychuk was, but I think that logic is dumb, because Andreychuk never belonged for a second.

Elias - He's closer than the zero votes dictate. He was better than Brind'Amour, but it was just less graphic. He played on defensive teams for a big part of his career and played defensively very well - at both C and LW. His chance at 100 points was derailed by Central European hookers, he wasn't made of stone, let's see yous resist...major, major factor in three deep runs in four years. 3x top-10 finishes in points despite, again, some situations to really produce. He deserves more credit in the poll, but is probably just a little short for me.

Brind'Amour - Lesser Elias really. A little better defensively, probably a little more worse offensively. Deserved a Conn Smythe in 2006 that he didn't get for whatever reason. Spent a lot of time as legitimately a second fiddle. Not really that close for me. HOVG.

Roenick - He was tracking that way until he had that early injury. He just wasn't quite the same after the injury and he became a good, fun-ish player to watch and not super impactful. If he kept things up after getting hurt, he's probably going that way, but, fact is, he didn't and he needed to...we can't take his word for it like a Lafontaine or a Kariya or a Lindros. He wasn't as good as any of them. He's an easy case for the "but mommmmmmmmmm, this guy is in" game, as he was better than Andreychuk and Nieuwendyk, for instance...but again, you're dumb idiot if you play that game. I'll pass on JR.

Turgeon - Another player that will get very underrated by this type of poll. Might be the most technically skilled player on the board. He just got hurt all the time and at the worst times...it probably cost him some serious hardware and other recognition. It's almost too fitting that our lasting moment of him is him scoring a goal and getting immediately injured thereafter. I'm not sure he's a HOFer for me, but he's better than 0 votes here. He was a whale of a talent, and it's not like he didn't produce. Canada also rarely, if ever, wanted him. On the flip side, they sometimes wanted Rob Zamuner...

CuJo - If there's such a thing as a bad team goalie, this is it? What he did for those early 90's Blues teams and late 90's Oilers teams was pretty unreal, but largely forgotten...What happened to him in '03 and '04 in Detroit is largely remembered and that's probably pretty unfair for his career value. Retired the all time leader in losses (now 3rd), but 4th in GP (now 6th). He was probably better than Barrasso. But was he better than Vanbiesbrouck? They're all pretty close, but none are in, and none are probably going. Off the ice stuff makes CuJo the favorite of the 3, I'd say pretty clearly. He's a 'no' from me, but I'd want him over Barrasso for his career I think.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby mikey » Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:06 pm

Ultimately, I went with Iginla and Mogilny, mostly because they were trailblazers for black players and Russians, respectively.
Trailblazers? I don't mean to twist your nips here, but I'm not sure I see the case for that...I also am not trying to lawyer you into submission here, so I'd like to hear where this is going...

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby King Colby » Tue Jun 23, 2020 12:40 am

Ultimately, I went with Iginla and Mogilny, mostly because they were trailblazers for black players and Russians, respectively.
Trailblazers? I don't mean to twist your nips here, but I'm not sure I see the case for that...I also am not trying to lawyer you into submission here, so I'd like to hear where this is going...
Not really anywhere. I remember mogilny being among the first Russians who did something but I dont even remember what and your palffy/naslund comps made me rethink. And Iginla is the best black player of all time, not that he needed to be a different race to get in.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Pavel Bure » Tue Jun 23, 2020 12:56 am


mikey
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HOF - yes or no?

Postby mikey » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:09 am

Ultimately, I went with Iginla and Mogilny, mostly because they were trailblazers for black players and Russians, respectively.
Trailblazers? I don't mean to twist your nips here, but I'm not sure I see the case for that...I also am not trying to lawyer you into submission here, so I'd like to hear where this is going...
Not really anywhere. I remember mogilny being among the first Russians who did something but I dont even remember what and your palffy/naslund comps made me rethink. And Iginla is the best black player of all time, not that he needed to be a different race to get in.
I guess, Mogilny had a loud season in 1993, but he wasn't the first over here. Fetisov was a better player and was instrumental in getting Soviets over here. He came in and was an impact player right away. So I don't think I can call AlMo a trailblazer in that sense...

Iginla is the best black player for sure, but obviously he had players that paved the way before him Fuhr, Graham, etc. He doesn't need any help on that type of caveat anyhow.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby mikey » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:14 am

I'll never quite get the infatuation with raw career totals in these type of articles. There's some very odd twisting of numbers in there, like percentage of seasons in which someone is a plus player...and then those weird adjusted points, which in theory is fine, but I never cared for how H-R did it...

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Gaucho » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:22 am

I picked Hossa, Iggy, and, because I'm a yinzer, Gonchar. I considered Elias but then asked myself if I'd do that if he didn't play his whole career for one team. I would probably not. But he has a better case than most of the others imo.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Gaucho » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:23 am

I think I also picked Mogilny for... some reason.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby mikey » Tue Jun 23, 2020 6:36 am

Gonchar going in would make Dan Boyle's ears perk up...

Mogilny going in is good news for Perry, Heatley, Palffy, and others...bad news for me haha

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Lelldorin » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:27 am

Iginla is a slam dunk. Hossa is ok for longevity.

I would rank Fleury as the next candidate, followed by Tkachuk and Mogilny. But I am not sure if any of these make it.

I would love me some Tkachuk or Fleury in their prime and they managed to play their styles over several (even more in Fleury's case) seasons . Mogilny has one insane season and then a few more great, which might be too little for the HoF.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby meow » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:47 am

Interesting that everyone but me thinks Iginla gets in.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Lelldorin » Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:03 am

Interesting that everyone but me thinks Iginla gets in.
What is not to like?

Apart from Bylsma playing him on the wrong wing :face: :scared:

One of the best wingers on this side of the year 2000. How many wingers have been better? Ovechkin and Jagr, sure. St Louis? Perry? Kane? Sedin? Most of these had better centers as well, I believe.

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HOF - yes or no?

Postby Dickie Dunn » Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:34 am

Dude had 625 goals while playing in an era that hated scoring. In which universe does he not get in?

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