Hockey Randomness

crusherstasiak
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Postby crusherstasiak » Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:07 pm

hey @mikey
i keep hearing about how the young players in the league are taking jobs from the 30 and over crowd
it goes something like this...
"these kids are good right out of the gate and now these 31/32/33 yr old players aren't in the league anymore"
etc
but they never mention who these 30&over crowd are
i can't think of any. i know fehr is still in the league so are these commentators blowing smoke and if not who are some of these players?
figure you'd know
thanks

Lemon Berry Lobster
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Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:55 pm

This is an absolutely nasty, sucker punch on Matt Calvert from the BENCH. No glove either. He takes his glove off and uppercuts a defenseless Calvert that is being held by Larkin. Go figure, a Bertuzzi sucker punching a member of the Avalanche.

https://streamable.com/zm7wm

https://www.milehighhockey.com/2018/12/ ... -avalanche
Two whole games.

mikey
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Postby mikey » Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:53 pm

hey @mikey
i keep hearing about how the young players in the league are taking jobs from the 30 and over crowd
it goes something like this...
"these kids are good right out of the gate and now these 31/32/33 yr old players aren't in the league anymore"
etc
but they never mention who these 30&over crowd are
i can't think of any. i know fehr is still in the league so are these commentators blowing smoke and if not who are some of these players?
figure you'd know
thanks
Obviously they're speaking in generalities, but the league is trending younger...I think a sign that the game is improving is having less older players able to hang on...

By way of example, I find that the league from around 1980 to 1984 or '85 or so was particularly weak...almost WWII level weak...

Fairly prominent early 80's guys crashed and burned pretty hard at around age 33 or 34 when the game took a turn for the better: King Richard, Don Lever, Peter McNab, Mike Milbury, Bobby Nystrom, Jim Schoenfeld, Bob Gainey, Lanny McDonald, Dave Lewis, Denis Potvin (relative to what he was doing), Tom Lysiak, Andre Savard, Blaine Stoughton, Blair MacDonald, Danny Gare, Doug Risebrough, Stef Persson, Mike Rogers, Mike Palmateer, Brian Engblom, Willi Plett, Wilf Paiement, Don Edwards, Pat Price, Dennis Maruk...

"Yes, but mikey, you can find examples in any era of players retiring early or breaking down early at any time...Mike Richards, etc. what's your point?"

Glad you asked mysterious stranger...my hypothesis is that 1980 to 1984 or 85 or 86 or so is a weaker time for hockey. Especially 1981 thru 1983. As such, that time extended the careers of players because it was easier to hang around. Where as, 1985, 86 or 87 somewhere in there, closed off the league from players hanging around (names noted above)...but what about on the whole?

Removing players with less than 100 career games to help to avoid Don Cherry's getting called up for a game here and there...

Year |Total |After 1980 |Pct that made it
1946 ...55 ..........9 ...........16.4%
1947 ...59 ..........13 ..........22.0%
1948 ...67 ..........20 ..........29.9%
1949 ...88 ..........33 ..........37.5%
1950 ...83 ..........33 ..........39.8%
1951 ...73 ..........30 ..........41.1%


Year | Total | After 1985 | Pct that made it
1952 ...97 ..........10 ..........10.3%
1953 ...87 ..........9 ..........10.3%
1954 ...104 ........19 ..........18.3%
1955 ...108 ........28 ..........25.9%
1956 ...99 ..........26 ..........26.3%

As you can see, it was terribly uncommon (comparatively) for the later birthdays (theoretically, access to slightly better training, advances, more rinks, etc.) to hang around through the mid-80's than it was for the 40's kids to hang on through the early 80's...

Plus, other such nonsense, like American high school kids that just waltzed into the league in the time that I'm saying is on the weaker side...Brian Lawton, Tom Barrasso, Phil Housley, Bobby Carpenter...all made some impact in the league (some more than others, naturally) fresh out of high school...U.S. high school...yet, just ten years before that, you could take every American in the NHL and put them on the same team and not have enough skaters...

So perhaps we're seeing a strengthening of the league, plus there's a salary cap that puts an emphasis on entry-level help...and maybe that's why Kevin Bieksa, Steve Mason, Kari Lehtonen, Josh Gorges, Matt Stajan, Jannik Hansen, Benoit Pouliot, Cody Franson, David Desharnais, etc. all don't have jobs in the league to the best of my knowledge...maybe there are other factors as well...

dodint
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Postby dodint » Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:57 pm

Interesting.

crusherstasiak
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Postby crusherstasiak » Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:07 pm

@mikey
thanks, dude
very interesting stuff. you ought to be getting paid.

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Postby shafnutz05 » Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:06 am

This is an absolutely nasty, sucker punch on Matt Calvert from the BENCH. No glove either. He takes his glove off and uppercuts a defenseless Calvert that is being held by Larkin. Go figure, a Bertuzzi sucker punching a member of the Avalanche.

https://streamable.com/zm7wm

https://www.milehighhockey.com/2018/12/ ... -avalanche
Two whole games.
That is absurdly low. He deliberately took off his glove and upper-cutted a guy who was being held. AND HE WAS ON THE FCKING BENCH.

Lemon Berry Lobster
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Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:14 am

This is an absolutely nasty, sucker punch on Matt Calvert from the BENCH. No glove either. He takes his glove off and uppercuts a defenseless Calvert that is being held by Larkin. Go figure, a Bertuzzi sucker punching a member of the Avalanche.

https://streamable.com/zm7wm

https://www.milehighhockey.com/2018/12/ ... -avalanche
Two whole games.
That is absurdly low. He deliberately took off his glove and upper-cutted a guy who was being held. AND HE WAS ON THE FCKING BENCH.
It definitely is too low, but I just saw this morning what that punk Calvert did to get Bertuzzi to lose his marbles. Now I'm not saying what Bertuzzi did was right, but I understand.

Side note: Nice to see that rivalry coming back. Was always a big fan of it.

meow
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Postby meow » Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:42 am

I’d like to see this kind of thing be an automatic suspension. Is this much different than leaving the bench to fight? That’s an automatic 10. Punching a player on the ice while you are on the bench should also be an automatic 10 gamer.

MR25
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Postby MR25 » Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:06 am

This is an absolutely nasty, sucker punch on Matt Calvert from the BENCH. No glove either. He takes his glove off and uppercuts a defenseless Calvert that is being held by Larkin. Go figure, a Bertuzzi sucker punching a member of the Avalanche.

https://streamable.com/zm7wm

https://www.milehighhockey.com/2018/12/ ... -avalanche
Two whole games.
That is absurdly low. He deliberately took off his glove and upper-cutted a guy who was being held. AND HE WAS ON THE FCKING BENCH.
It definitely is too low, but I just saw this morning what that punk Calvert did to get Bertuzzi to lose his marbles. Now I'm not saying what Bertuzzi did was right, but I understand.

Side note: Nice to see that rivalry coming back. Was always a big fan of it.

You mean when they grabbed Calvert's stick and wouldn't let go?

Lemon Berry Lobster
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Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:08 am

This is an absolutely nasty, sucker punch on Matt Calvert from the BENCH. No glove either. He takes his glove off and uppercuts a defenseless Calvert that is being held by Larkin. Go figure, a Bertuzzi sucker punching a member of the Avalanche.

https://streamable.com/zm7wm

https://www.milehighhockey.com/2018/12/ ... -avalanche
Two whole games.
That is absurdly low. He deliberately took off his glove and upper-cutted a guy who was being held. AND HE WAS ON THE FCKING BENCH.
It definitely is too low, but I just saw this morning what that punk Calvert did to get Bertuzzi to lose his marbles. Now I'm not saying what Bertuzzi did was right, but I understand.

Side note: Nice to see that rivalry coming back. Was always a big fan of it.

You mean when they grabbed Calvert's stick and wouldn't let go?
Nah, I mean when he jammed it back into them after trying to pull it out.

MR25
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Postby MR25 » Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:33 am

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes?

Lemon Berry Lobster
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Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:58 am

They're both idiots, I agree.

Gaucho
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Postby Gaucho » Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:55 am


Gaucho
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Postby Gaucho » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:13 pm

The Supersonics will begin play in 2021.

crusherstasiak
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Postby crusherstasiak » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:17 pm

So perhaps we're seeing a strengthening of the league, plus there's a salary cap that puts an emphasis on entry-level help...and maybe that's why Kevin Bieksa, Steve Mason, Kari Lehtonen, Josh Gorges, Matt Stajan, Jannik Hansen, Benoit Pouliot, Cody Franson, David Desharnais, etc. all don't have jobs in the league to the best of my knowledge...maybe there are other factors as well...
derek roy is another
he's playing in sweden

dodint
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Postby dodint » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:18 pm

So dumb. Contract two awful teams now, pls.

dodint
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Postby dodint » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:20 pm

@mikey will this and the Vegas addition usher in another era of players pushing 40 as the norm? Or will it remain a bunch of untalented younger players filling the bottoms of NHL rosters?

NTP66
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Postby NTP66 » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:23 pm

So dumb. Contract two awful teams now, pls.

Gaucho
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Postby Gaucho » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:26 pm

With ever more people playing hockey, why would there not be more teams?

Also, move the Coyotes to Houston and the Panthers to Quebec.

nocera
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Postby nocera » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:40 pm

At least we know where Murray will be playing in 2021.

Dickie Dunn
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Postby Dickie Dunn » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:48 pm

Image

Lemon Berry Lobster
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Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:51 pm

Dreger was saying yesterday that Arizona isn't happy about that move.

dodint
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Postby dodint » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:52 pm

**** those dadholes.

Dickie Dunn
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Postby Dickie Dunn » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:57 pm

Dreger was saying yesterday that Arizona isn't happy about that move.
They can **** off and move to a different city then.

Same rules for the expansion draft except Vegas is exempt, but also won't be getting a share of the expansion fee.
Last edited by Dickie Dunn on Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mikey
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Postby mikey » Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:58 pm

@mikey will this and the Vegas addition usher in another era of players pushing 40 as the norm? Or will it remain a bunch of untalented younger players filling the bottoms of NHL rosters?
I think this will extend the shelf life of adaptable goalies a little perhaps...it depends a little bit too on the health of top European leagues...if the KHL loses 6 teams in the next three years, about half of those guys could play in the NHL give or take, all things being equal...the Slovaks are starting to creep back in, the Swiss make talent now, I expect Germany to start producing some talent soon...might give them enough rope...

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