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dodint
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Postby dodint » Thu May 24, 2018 10:04 am

I don't have time to get into it today; my bottom line is that if Trump the man uses his influence to affect the market without taking any actual political action as the Executive it's not the same as Trump using the government to attack a private entity. We could spend hours arguing about where the line is between Trump Private Citizen and Trump the President if you want but if he uses the office to attack a private entity checks and balances will reel him in, like with the Amazon/USPS issue.

Is it shitty? Sure, Trump is shitty. Could the NFL have shown an ounce of character for once? Yes, and they failed, per usual.

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Postby nocera » Thu May 24, 2018 10:10 am

Source of the post Trump Private Citizen and Trump the President
There is no line as the Twitter account he uses to moan about the NFL is the same one he uses for official presidential announcements.

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Postby Troy Loney » Thu May 24, 2018 10:10 am

I don't have time to get into it today; my bottom line is that if Trump the man uses his influence to affect the market without taking any actual political action as the Executive it's not the same as Trump using the government to attack a private entity. We could spend hours arguing about where the line is between Trump Private Citizen and Trump the President if you want but if he uses the office to attack a private entity checks and balances will reel him in, like with the Amazon/USPS issue.

Is it shitty? Sure, Trump is shitty. Could the NFL have shown an ounce of character for once? Yes, and they failed, per usual.
I think you are very wrong. What we're seeing is Trump trying to use his power and influence to hurt Amazon, but he is constrained due to the nature of Amazon's business. With the NFL, he is able to use his position to impact their business.

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Postby dodint » Thu May 24, 2018 10:31 am

I don't have time to get into it today; my bottom line is that if Trump the man uses his influence to affect the market without taking any actual political action as the Executive it's not the same as Trump using the government to attack a private entity. We could spend hours arguing about where the line is between Trump Private Citizen and Trump the President if you want but if he uses the office to attack a private entity checks and balances will reel him in, like with the Amazon/USPS issue.

Is it shitty? Sure, Trump is shitty. Could the NFL have shown an ounce of character for once? Yes, and they failed, per usual.
I think you are very wrong. What we're seeing is Trump trying to use his power and influence to hurt Amazon, but he is constrained due to the nature of Amazon's business. With the NFL, he is able to use his position to impact their business.
He is constrained by the terms of the contract made between Amazon and USPS. He is blocked by that contract from effecting the change he wants. The system is working. He tried to use his political office to harm Amazon and the constraints of the admin law system curtailed his effort. This is differentiated from him having tantrums on Twitter and NFL executives reacting with cowardice. Amazon/USPS used the protection of the system, the NFL tucked tail and didn't try to use the system at all.

They're very different situations.

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Postby NTP66 » Thu May 24, 2018 10:34 am

His words alone caused the stock to tank, regardless of whether or not he could actually make any changes.

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Postby Troy Loney » Thu May 24, 2018 10:36 am

It seems like you're understanding, but there's still a gap there somewhere.

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Postby dodint » Thu May 24, 2018 10:36 am

That's a market reaction not tied to the intrinsic value of the stock and I'm certain it corrected almost immediately.

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Postby dodint » Thu May 24, 2018 10:43 am

It seems like you're understanding, but there's still a gap there somewhere.
The gap is you haven't shown me anywhere that President Trump used the Office of the President to order a policy change that would harm the NFL.

I do not care about the utterances of a manchild that happens to be President. I've been saying for years that the Executive Office is much weaker than most Americans understand, even when it's demonstrated in real time.

Do I think high level politicians can induce market reactions with non-official opinions? Yes. But they're not substantial reactions with tangible effects until they're mated to an actual political action. The NFL is getting pushed around by Trump because they've made awful PR choices over the last five years or so and now they're backpedaling hard. They created this for themselves in a myriad of different ways and they're continuing it by accommodating Trump. They're getting pushed around because they allow themselves to be pushed around. F them for having no courage.

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Postby Morkle » Thu May 24, 2018 12:02 pm

I don't have time to get into it today; my bottom line is that if Trump the man uses his influence to affect the market without taking any actual political action as the Executive it's not the same as Trump using the government to attack a private entity. We could spend hours arguing about where the line is between Trump Private Citizen and Trump the President if you want but if he uses the office to attack a private entity checks and balances will reel him in, like with the Amazon/USPS issue.

Is it shitty? Sure, Trump is shitty. Could the NFL have shown an ounce of character for once? Yes, and they failed, per usual.
I think you are very wrong. What we're seeing is Trump trying to use his power and influence to hurt Amazon, but he is constrained due to the nature of Amazon's business. With the NFL, he is able to use his position to impact their business.
He is constrained by the terms of the contract made between Amazon and USPS. He is blocked by that contract from effecting the change he wants. The system is working. He tried to use his political office to harm Amazon and the constraints of the admin law system curtailed his effort. This is differentiated from him having tantrums on Twitter and NFL executives reacting with cowardice. Amazon/USPS used the protection of the system, the NFL tucked tail and didn't try to use the system at all.

They're very different situations.
Except his tweets did damage. https://www.investors.com/news/technolo ... zon-stock/
That contrasted with Monday, when the company's stock plunged 5.2% following a Trump tweet. It accompanied a tumble of 2.7% for the Nasdaq, 1.9% for the Dow Jones industrial average and 2.2% for the S&P 500.
That's not to say the Amazon's stock didn't rebound - but he certainly changed the outcome of a day or two in terms of stock performance.

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Postby MWB » Thu May 24, 2018 12:06 pm

I don't think there's such a thing as "Trump Private Citizen." He is "Trump the President" until he's no longer in office.

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Postby Morkle » Thu May 24, 2018 12:06 pm

Ok, you basically responded above mine. I do argue that Amazon is big enough to not really be impacted by stock dips. I could easily see a smaller company be concerned if called out and it ending being damaging.

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Postby tifosi77 » Thu May 24, 2018 12:07 pm

Which is less about Jeff Bezos being the richest man in the world, than about people who have AMZN stock in their portfolios.

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Postby Troy Loney » Thu May 24, 2018 12:14 pm

I think Trump even attempting to pull internal levers to try and sink amazon is enough, but this is an agree to disagree because it is objectively true that he is adequately constrained from doing anything more than cause short run equity value drops for the company.

I genuinely disagree with Dodints NFL take though, I think it fails to appreciate the series of corporate partnerships that are vulnerable to Trump influence. Look at AT&T, they are clearly trying to get on the ins with Trump with regards to this merger, could that impact their willingness to continue with the sunday ticket thing?

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Postby tifosi77 » Thu May 24, 2018 12:16 pm

Sunday Ticket was cited as almost the sole reason AT&T sought to acquire DirecTV, but I get your point.

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Postby NTP66 » Thu May 24, 2018 1:36 pm

Image

dodint
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Postby dodint » Thu May 24, 2018 1:38 pm

Yeah, that's the mindless crap I was talking about earlier, good example NTP66.

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Postby NTP66 » Thu May 24, 2018 1:43 pm

Happy to oblige.

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Postby shafnutz05 » Thu May 24, 2018 7:53 pm

WELL-MEMED

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Postby MWB » Wed May 30, 2018 12:48 pm

Doesn't really seem appropriate.
While testifying as part of the Colin Kaepernick collusion case, Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones said Trump spoke with him about the anthem.

"This is very winning, strong issue for me," Jones said Trump told him during a phone call. "Tell everybody, you can't win this one. This one lifts me."
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2365 ... them-views

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Postby shafnutz05 » Wed May 30, 2018 12:55 pm

. "Tell everybody, you can't win this one. This one lifts me."
Image

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Sun Jun 03, 2018 4:04 pm

Huh, I just learned Peter King left MMQB/SI for a gig at NBC Sports doing PFT Live.

NTP66
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Postby NTP66 » Sun Jun 03, 2018 6:50 pm

Peter King = long-winded ****

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Postby Viva la Ben » Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:50 pm

Trump has disinvited the Philadelphia Eagles to the White House because some of their players disagreed with the president’s stance on the national anthem.

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Postby NTP66 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:05 am

President Petulance, ladies and gentlemen.

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Postby MrKennethTKangaroo » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:38 am

This reminds me of the poochie episode from the Simpsons. Desperate for attention

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