Thread of Love v6.9

[Kaiser]

I have never been on a date. I let things happen organically, and they go where they go. Trying to set up a meeting with someone I just met or never met has never made sense to me. Go do things you like doing, you'll meet other people who like doing those things. Built in commonality.

[mikey]

Damn...shy doesn't begin to describe it...and yeah, that look a lot to say even in this semi-anonymous venue...

[dodint]

Anonymous? I've been to his house.

If he's happy then it works. Better than forcing something to align with a dated norm.

[Kaiser]

One of the reasons I was able to slay (before marriage) Was that I never tried. When I went out, I was there for fun and fun only. No pickup lines, no asking for numbers. Doing that stuff a million times doesn't mean the dating world is f***ed. To me you sound desperate. If you didn't have a girl I'd tell you to bench yourself for awhile and stop caring so much.

Desperation has nothing to do with it. I could’ve been in a relationship a long time ago. But I knew those women weren’t right for me and I had to end it

I know it sounds odd considering I mentioned paradox of choice before but I know how important it is to not just find someone but to find someone you’re really compatible with and I knew I just wasn’t compatible. I’m guessing if I was desperate I wouldn’t have cared about that and just jumped into whatever to not be alone

That makes sense, and maybe you're willing to be more personal here so it sounds like a perpetual issue. What I'm saying is that knowing someone better before anything romantic happens is much better than beating your head against walls with people you don't know, and then letting it affect you.

[MWB]

One of the reasons I was able to slay (before marriage) Was that I never tried. When I went out, I was there for fun and fun only. No pickup lines, no asking for numbers. Doing that stuff a million times doesn't mean the dating world is f***ed. To me you sound desperate. If you didn't have a girl I'd tell you to bench yourself for awhile and stop caring so much.

Desperation has nothing to do with it. I could’ve been in a relationship a long time ago. But I knew those women weren’t right for me and I had to end it

I know it sounds odd considering I mentioned paradox of choice before but I know how important it is to not just find someone but to find someone you’re really compatible with and I knew I just wasn’t compatible. I’m guessing if I was desperate I wouldn’t have cared about that and just jumped into whatever to not be alone

So you made a mature decision. And a decision that was right for you. There are plenty of people who have no problem going through partner after partner and not worrying about a commitment. I’m someone who is more like you and don’t like casual dating, but there’s nothing wrong with people who do. I think dating apps expose that more. And people like you and I who don’t like the casual scene find dating in general more difficult. The apps just amplify the normal dating issues.

[Shyster]

I have never been on a date. I let things happen organically, and they go where they go. Trying to set up a meeting with someone I just met or never met has never made sense to me. Go do things you like doing, you'll meet other people who like doing those things. Built in commonality.

One of the problems is that I don't like doing things that involve other people. I certainly do not enjoy interacting with people I don't know. Having to mingle at some sort of social event is pretty close to my definition of hell.

[Kaiser]

I have never been on a date. I let things happen organically, and they go where they go. Trying to set up a meeting with someone I just met or never met has never made sense to me. Go do things you like doing, you'll meet other people who like doing those things. Built in commonality.

One of the problems is that I don't like doing things that involve other people. I certainly do not enjoy interacting with people I don't know. Having to mingle at some sort of social event is pretty close to my definition of hell.

Is it a problem though? I'm most comfortable at home with my video games, music, TV, and nobody else. Like I said I don't go places to meet people, I go when I want to do something there. Other people can enter my space if they want, but I'm not going to chase them. I wasn't trying to act like I'm charlie sheen or something.

[mikey]

For the record, I did very little with apps...I feel like I got like two kills all time in the short amount of time I had an app or two lying around...but I'm also really comfortable in bars, clubs, music shows, and just generally any place where there's a room of people...I've said it before, but if you're not that happy with the outcome of apps (generally), I'd just make a change...your person (MIMH) that talks like someone that tries to grow as a person (therapy, improv, amateur plumbing), I'm a tiny bit surprised you don't take an extended break from the apps and go a completely different direction...but maybe you do and we just don't have the full play by play...

[Lemon Berry Lobster]

The apps are definitely geared towards the younger people, early/mid 20s. I had some wild interactions through those things and now in my mid 30s they're just not it. After this past weekend I uninstalled the one I was using.

[Shyster]

Is it a problem though? I'm most comfortable at home with my video games, music, TV, and nobody else. Like I said I don't go places to meet people, I go when I want to do something there. Other people can enter my space if they want, but I'm not going to chase them. I wasn't trying to act like I'm charlie sheen or something.

I suppose it's a problem if I want someone else in my life. As it stands now, I'm going to be one of those people where the police knock down the door and find their body like two weeks after they die because the mailman noticed that my mailbox was full and called them. Or maybe because some neighbor notices the smell.

[meecrofilm]

Oh wow, gents. So much to catch up on in this thread. Seeing as I'm out of town on a business trip holed up in my hotel room, this seems like a great time to delve into an unnecessarily-long post of thoughts, reader be warned. For the sake of the thread I'll spoiler tag it:

Getting rejected in and of itself isn’t a problem. It can be a positive result. To me the big piece is “are you being authentic to yourself when you’re on the dates?” If the answer is yes then unfortunately sometimes it just comes down to puckluck. If it’s no then that’s when I’d recommend someone analyze their process to consider how they can be more genuine

Agree 100%. A huge breakthrough for me in dating was abandoning whatever "game" or "rules" I felt like I had to follow for whatever reason, and just letting my flag fly right off the bat. Saved a lot of time both ways.

the place that I had the most opportunity to do this was, kind of interestingly, at a yoga/hot Pilates studio. Now, while I joined (with a female friend) with the ultimate intention of trying to meet women, I played the long game. It was close to a year until I finally asked one out, because I wanted to avoid being the creepy guy who joined only to ask women out.

You see the contradiction here, right? I think there's a clear difference between "hey I'm going to try out a class to learn this new skill and hopefully I'll meet people, but if I don't, at least I'll get something from it" vs the above. Honestly I feel like that's a bit worse. Better that some guy put his cards on the table right away. Intentionally hiding your intentions in the name of some "long game" feels like some next-level deceit, and is even more ingenuine.

Do Improv classes. Lots of interesting people do those.

I agree in that improv was probably the place where I met the absolute coolest people. Like, you have to be both funny and super nice to do improv so it’s the perfect combo for finding friends

Agreed x2. Super fun and positive community. I'll always recommend anyone take an improv 101 class, regardless if they're looking to meet people with for intention of dating or whatever. Let it be known MiMH legit posted a class show video he was in. A Harold class, no less. That takes some major shtones (Gary Oldman 5th Element voice). Respect to that.

In 99% of all cases, funny people are people that are damaged and went through stuff...pretty girls, comparatively, don't go through as much stuff...there's no fire for comedy. You'll meet a "cool" girl probably...but depending on where you're at on the pecking order, you're not going to meet a physically attractive one. Tough nuts, but that's the deal in society...

Tangent city right here on two accounts:

First one, different types of comedy/theater. This is coming from someone with about a decade of experience in the PGH comedy scene (so, hardly an expert, but still...). Stand-ups in general are the most self-deprecating and self-loathing. A few that I'm friends with who also do improv are self-aware enough to know by-and-large they're a fairly miserable bunch. So when we're talking about "funny" in comedy, we need to be more specific. Calling back the aforementioned improv posts, there are a plenty of attractive and mentally well-off women (and men) doing improv. It's a skill-set that doesn't rely as much on negative self-introspection or trauma (I don't think stand-up needs to either, but that's a discussion for another thread). So you can absolutely meet both a cool and attractive girl in comedy...just the odds are more stacked in one discipline than another (mostly because they're less likely to keep at it in the stand-up scene). And then, there are community theater actors. By and large, closet-egotistical wildcards. So...you know.....people :laugh:

Secondly..."pretty girls, comparatively, don't go through as much stuff." Especially since we're looking at this through a comedy lens, let's just call it out...pretty guys don't go through as much stuff. I'd argue pretty guys go through less than pretty girls, particularly in the world of comedy. But let's just look at it from a stand-up comedy perspective, which (as has been addressed in other threads) is a largely male-dominated world with men as the gatekeepers at every level. Who are the current more famous male stand-ups, and those in the past -- are any of them what we'd define as lookers? Not too many really come to mind for me. So, idk man...I think if we wanna say "pretty people don't go through as much stuff" so they can't be damaged/funny, then sure. Limiting that theory to women says more about some of the issues in this thread than anything, imo.

Right now is the best time in the history of the world for people who want to find hookups/casual engagements. But that mindset really only benefits the more physically attractive people so we have a bit of a "wealth inequality" issue right now where the most attractive demographics for both men and women are highly successful but anyone within one standard deviation of "average attractiveness" are on the struggle bus.

I think this attitude is bullshit by-and-large, tbh. To take a bit of a crass approach to this...
Yes, very attractive people have a generally higher hook-up success rate. 8-10s have good shots to hook up with other 8-10s. But if they choose, they can generally find lower #'s who would be happy to hook up with them. Conversely, your 5-7s can generally hook up with other 5-7s, but they might also try to shoot higher (and w/e, go for it). AND, they can also choose to shoot lower, but often don't (most people don't. And again, I know this is a massive generality, and mostly aimed at hook-up culture). So when people at a certain level of attractiveness claim to be on the struggle bus.......okay look, I also identify in the 5-7 range, and there were several girls over the years either in that range (mostly below, probably by own imperfect science) who were into me, who I could've dated or hooked up with if I wanted to, but since I wasn't into them, I chose not to. I wouldn't define that as a "struggle bus" even though I was single for a while and also not getting any.
At some level, it's a choice. If there's someone who's at an average attractiveness level struggling finding someone, I guarantee there's someone below their standards who is into them. Just like there is someone out of their league who they are pursuing and ideally want to be with. So I don't think people of mid-level attractiveness can poo-poo more attractive people dating each other and turning them down, when said "mids" do the same thing to those below them who are out their own self-designated league. It goes both ways. But I don't deny the "higher" you are, the more options there intrinsically are.

Aiy-yai-yai. Reddit evidence, man. This is like Barbie 2.0 re: the adversarial approach so many men take vs women. Just taking a quote from that preview:

"Then I have to keep convo alive during this time by texting a witty meme, or a sunset I saw, or a "hope you have a breezy day at work."

No, no, no you don't don't. I have a friend like this, who complains how hard it is to date as a guy, all the games you have to play, etc., and it's sad since I don't know where he bought into this approach, but I know he'll probably never find someone due to his attitude. He often talks about how "difficult/crazy females" are. It'd bad. The kind of person who looks for someone else to fulfill their own happiness and self-worth. You know, seeing single women not as potential partners, but as solutions. It's a bummer and it's ****-up.

I actually found online dating to be pretty fun and had a lot of success with it. I may have had more of the "Kaiser" attitude to it. You almost have to take a casino-like approach to it, which make sense, since the nature of the apps is almost designed like a game (which is probably where the problem lies for many...distilling people and personalities down to little dopamine hits. You can only control yourself, not others, and know what you're getting into. Easier said than done, sure). You can't get too high or too low, but you still absolutely have to invest every time you roll the dice or get dealt a hand, otherwise, what the hell are you even doing there in the first place? And you'll get burnt more often than not (to quote the great Nada Surf: "There's still a feeling of rejection when someone says [they] prefer the company of others to your exclusive company.") But you just need to hit it big that one time.....
I'd almost miss it, but I met my current GF a few years ago on bumble, and we've got a great thing going, so cool, it served it's purpose for me, and I'm thankful I got lucky.

tl;dr, insufferable guy thinks he's figured out online dating since he's in a relationship that started from online dating.

[meecrofilm]

Also, MR25 a few pages back: that sucks man. Condolences.

[MalkinIsMyHomeboy]

For the record, I did very little with apps...I feel like I got like two kills all time in the short amount of time I had an app or two lying around...but I'm also really comfortable in bars, clubs, music shows, and just generally any place where there's a room of people...I've said it before, but if you're not that happy with the outcome of apps (generally), I'd just make a change...your person (MIMH) that talks like someone that tries to grow as a person (therapy, improv, amateur plumbing), I'm a tiny bit surprised you don't take an extended break from the apps and go a completely different direction...but maybe you do and we just don't have the full play by play...

lol I started using dating apps in 2012. I definitely took plenty of breaks


hell, I took a year off from this site because y’all caused me so much stress (the last page or so where it feels like I’m getting randomly **** thrown at me is kind of an example of why I took the time off)


it’s weird. two posts above this and meecro is calling me “insufferable”. Definitely don’t know what I did to deserve that

[MalkinIsMyHomeboy]

btw this is what I was talking about with the “wealth inequality” in dating apps. The % is the percentage of likes that demographic gets

so, for example, the top 10% of men get 58% of all likes



the data is from an engineer who worked on Hinge

https://qz.com/1051462/these-statistics ... ating-apps

[Kaiser]

Are those "likes" based on interaction or merely the profile? If it's the latter, Those stats only reinforce what I said earlier. Boiling people down to stats is going to tell you to think of them as stats. Are you a number? Are you your f***ing khakis? Or are you a deep person with a lot of interesting qualities, years of past experiences and far reaching visions of the future for yourself? Everyone is someone.

I can tell you I've met very attractive women and men who absolutely repulsed me with their behavior. I have no doubt they could go get laid or find someone on a dating app to hit the like button. Show me the stats on how many of them found a soulmate while being total buttholes to everyone around them. Just because app dating is available now doesn't mean it changed our species. If you want to find someone who's "right" and compatible, you have to get beyond dating app stats. Who gives a rats ass what the top 10% of people are doing? It's your life. You have to live it on your terms.

[Shyster]

I suppose in the abstract there might be "someone below their standards who is into them," but I can personally say that if any woman on Earth has ever had any romantic interest in me, I've never noticed it. I concede it's possible it might have occurred, and I might have not noticed because I'm very much not good at social stuff or picking up cues, but I've never noticed it.

For some, it's not really a matter of attractiveness. I've always been overweight, so that's a big negative, but neither am I like screaming lightspeed ugly, either. (I suppose dodint could weigh in on that, since he's actually met me.) I'm just spectacularly bad at interacting with other people. It takes months if not years before I'm comfortable in person around other people, and it's a major effort to deal with other people in person even on a professional level. Heck, there are family members I have a hard time talking with because I don't see them very often and therefore don't know them very well. This is one of the reasons I suspect that I could be on the spectrum; one of the characteristics of people with high-functioning autism is that they are often very poor at picking up and interpreting social cues from other people, which makes it a major struggle to interact with people on a face-to-face basis. If I don't know someone, it's hell to talk to them. For example, for that one date I went on, I was diligently trying to be far more open and communicative that I would otherwise be precisely because I know that I have a hard time talking to people. The woman I went out with (for a meal only) was a med student working with my mother, and she told my mother afterwards that she felt like she had to drag every word out of me and carry the entire conversation. And that's when I was specifically making an effort to talk more and constantly telling myself to keep talking, ask her questions about herself, etc.

Funny thing is, I would imagine there are women out there my age who would be interested in me. I have a sold, high-paying job, I own my own house and car, I have no personal debts, I'm not a momma's boy (and mom is out of the picture anyway), I'm not a drunk or druggie, and I don't have any kids. But the notion of trying to find one of those women is so daunting to me that I basically just... don't.

[MWB]

Are those "likes" based on interaction or merely the profile? If it's the latter, Those stats only reinforce what I said earlier. Boiling people down to stats is going to tell you to think of them as stats. Are you a number? Are you your f***ing khakis? Or are you a deep person with a lot of interesting qualities, years of past experiences and far reaching visions of the future for yourself? Everyone is someone.

I can tell you I've met very attractive women and men who absolutely repulsed me with their behavior. I have no doubt they could go get laid or find someone on a dating app to hit the like button. Show me the stats on how many of them found a soulmate while being total buttholes to everyone around them. Just because app dating is available now doesn't mean it changed our species. If you want to find someone who's "right" and compatible, you have to get beyond dating app stats. Who gives a rats ass what the top 10% of people are doing? It's your life. You have to live it on your terms.

Exactly. From the article: “Hinge is based on a system of “liking” some particular aspect of a person’s profile.” It’s surface level, which is really the only way for a dating app to initiate interactions for people. Most people who are looking for a partner will constantly “rate” a potential partner in their head. Even out shopping, you might see someone and think wow, she’s really attractive. If you’re at a bar and strike up a conversation and it goes well, you might think she’s got a great personality. Or we’ve got a lot in common. Those are “likes” in the real world. But the surface level “likes” in the real world happen a lot more because you just see more people than you interact with. It’s the same on dating apps.

[dodint]

For some, it's not really a matter of attractiveness. I've always been overweight, so that's a big negative, but neither am I like screaming lightspeed ugly, either. (I suppose dodint could weigh in on that, since he's actually met me.)

Can confirm. Normal looking dude. No militia gear or cammo in sight. Probably uses the term "obese" in the literal CDC standard sense because he doesn't look fat either. He's that college professor that was effectual but you forgot his name a year after graduation.

[MWB]

These apps absolutely help people who aren't as good interacting with people face to face. I'm very similar to shyster in terms of how I am with others in person, but I knew that I wanted someone else in my life to really be happy. It's nearly impossible for me to start a conversation with a stranger and it's hard for me to keep a conversation going. I've gotten a little better over the years, but I'm always known as the shy one. One year I started working in a new room with someone I'd never met in the room next to me. After about a week she went to another teacher, who happened to be my friend and said, "So is he an dadhole or does he just not like me?" After a little while we became friends and still talk to this day. But that was through being forced to share a common area. Nearly every relationship I've had was started online; the others were through work. Online I can do what I can't do in person. I can talk, open up a little, be a little funny, let my personality show. Then when we meet in person I'm much more comfortable. So for someone like me, dating apps were a way to break down the barrier in my own mind.

[meecrofilm]

it’s weird. two posts above this and meecro is calling me “insufferable”. Definitely don’t know what I did to deserve that

Dude I'm referring to myself there. It's my own tl;dr post and I was summarizing my own unnecessarily long-winded post, hence the descriptor...

[meow]

Anonymous? I've been to his house.

would you consider that a date? sounds like a date

[dodint]

Best part: my wife was there and watched.

[meecrofilm]

These apps absolutely help people who aren't as good interacting with people face to face. I'm very similar to shyster in terms of how I am with others in person, but I knew that I wanted someone else in my life to really be happy. It's nearly impossible for me to start a conversation with a stranger and it's hard for me to keep a conversation going. I've gotten a little better over the years, but I'm always known as the shy one. One year I started working in a new room with someone I'd never met in the room next to me. After about a week she went to another teacher, who happened to be my friend and said, "So is he an dadhole or does he just not like me?" After a little while we became friends and still talk to this day. But that was through being forced to share a common area. Nearly every relationship I've had was started online; the others were through work. Online I can do what I can't do in person. I can talk, open up a little, be a little funny, let my personality show. Then when we meet in person I'm much more comfortable. So for someone like me, dating apps were a way to break down the barrier in my own mind.

Yeah that's all fairly similar for my experiences as well. Especially in a public place/space, I would err on the side of letting people mind their own business. It's certainly easier to get a foot in the door on the apps (or, at least, the illusion of the foot in the door, which isn't necessarily the best thing).

A shitty thing about apps I don't think was mentioned earlier when the downsides were discussed: when you first sign-up the algorithm will bump up your profile and you'll get a lot of matches. That's good. Then once you've been on for a little the algorithm will bury your profile, and in order to get more action you have to pay for boosts (this is true for both Tinder and Bumble at least). That's bad. People found a workaround at one point where they could delete their profile and start a new one and get the boost again, but the companies may have figured out a way to prevent that now, idk, it's been a couple years.

That's kind of where the "video game" aspect of the apps comes into play. You're on the phone, sitting on the couch or taking a **** or whatever, take out the app to pass the time, get a dopamine hit. I'd almost miss it if my current situation wasn't so great. I was good at it (this absolutely plays into the "game-ification" of it) -- I can see how it might desensitize some people, to make them see potential partners less as "people" and more as like, little accomplishments to boost their own self-esteem. Not denying that. But they've also been a big benefit to a lot of people too, myself included, so I can't deny that side of it either.

[King Colby]

Imo is nice to have a neutral party call you out

why the **** does anyone need to be “called out”?


I genuinely don’t understand yalls angle. I’m getting pretty vulnerable here talking about something that made me detest living (trying to find a partner) and again, for whatever reason, it’s just turning into **** on MIMH mode. I’m not going after anyone, just talking about painfully difficult it is for people who are single these days yet it’s turned into this dumb bullshit

C2i and I both independently drew the conclusion from your original post that you honestly believe the only reason this girl is with you is because you were her first match and she hasn't taken the time to try to find someone better.

We're on your side here pal, and we're telling you that you need to realize you're good enough for anyone, as long as you're good enough for you.

I think you're so naturally inclined to dunk on yourself that you don't even realize you're doing it. That's why you're being called out - in a productive way - so that you realize you're doing it and hopefully it makes you call on what you've learned in your 6 years of therapy to think differently.

Shes with you because she likes you. Period.

[King Colby]

One of the reasons I was able to slay (before marriage) Was that I never tried. When I went out, I was there for fun and fun only. No pickup lines, no asking for numbers. Doing that stuff a million times doesn't mean the dating world is f***ed. To me you sound desperate. If you didn't have a girl I'd tell you to bench yourself for awhile and stop caring so much.

Big facts here. When there's no agenda, you can't fail. When you can't fail, you exude confidence. When you exude confidence, you're getting empty netters.