Fifth Avenue Forum

-950

Yeah but what were the odds that Jordan was a degenerate gambler back in 96

David stern will never tell.

Somewhere this team learned how to scout hitters. Their stock of young hitters is quite something.

The Athletics appear close to severing ties with Oakland after 56 years and making a minor league ballpark in West Sacramento their interim home before the expected move to Las Vegas for the 2028 season.

The team met with Sacramento officials Wednesday. According to a report by Sacramento radio personality Dave Weiglein of Sactown Sports, the team will announce its decision to relocate either Thursday or Friday. If the move comes to fruition, the A's will share Sutter Health Park with the San Francisco Giants' Triple-A team, the RiverCats, for up to three seasons beginning next season. There was no indication the A's informed Oakland of their plans.

What a disaster of a franchise. A triple-A park is where they belong.

what happened to them? they're a historically significant team and the Moneyball stuff was at least cute but they've been a joke for some time now

what happened to them? they're a historically significant team and the Moneyball stuff was at least cute but they've been a joke for some time now

Back to Charlie Finley, they're notoriously cheap.

God Arizona looks miserable

Shane Bieber getting TJ surgery, and looking like Spencer Strider has a tear in his UCL.

PA is going after the clock for the reason for this.

I've seen Twitter comments alluding to that, but the TJs have been ticking up for years it seems. The Pirates have had multiple pitchers recovering from that surgery per year for years it seems.

I think it's simple science - most bodies aren't built to throw as fast and hard as they do.

There is a reason pitchers threw more innings, on shorter rests, all with higher pitch counts with the diet of John Daly years ago.

I think it's simple science - most bodies aren't built to throw as fast and hard as they do.

There is a reason pitchers threw more innings, on shorter rests, all with higher pitch counts with the diet of John Daly years ago.

This is it. 90MPH was fast when I was a kid.

Plus spin rates are insane. An arm isn't supposed to maneuver like that

Keller is going to likely need it this year too. Reading the tea leaves, he’s been throwing some pitch this year that is easier on the arm and its not effective.

but then...

The pitch clock excuse is pretty funny. How does delivering a pitch every 15-20 seconds versus every 25-30 seconds make a difference? They're using that as a crutch to mask the fact that analytics tell these guys that velocity is king and that includes throwing "off-speed" pitches as hard as possible. Great, if you want to have a quick 4-5 year career, great. Look at a guy like Stephen Strasburg who announced his retirement last night. He shredded his arm trying to reach maximum velocity and while it got him a couple of really good years, he wasn't reliable enough to stay healthy for a sustained amount of time. Spencer Strider and Shane Bieber had the chance to be generational stars but now they'll be able to hang their careers on 2 or 3 really good years and that might be it. They certainly don't make 'em like they used to and they definitely don't coach 'em like they used to either. Unless something drastic happens (for example, trashing the idea of analytics), this is going to be norm and not the exception.

I think it can be a combination of both, OP. Analytics drives pitchers toward higher spin rates and higher velocity. But there's a reason for that...high velocity with high spin rate is really, really hard to hit. So I think it's more pitchers are willing to push their arms to the limit to achieve both. Couple that with TJ surgery has basically become commonplace and almost expected. I don't think pitchers really feel the need to try to avoid it, if that makes sense.

The pitch clock would certainly affect some more than others. I'd think especially long innings would be particularly stressing, and mechanics can break down pretty quickly if you start to get fatigued. And a little wonky hiccup in your delivery could be bad given how much stress they're putting on their elbows on virtually every throw.

1 thing I don't know and have never looked at...is TJ the result of wear and tear, or is an injury that occurs on one particular throw?

I believe it's more of a wear & tear thing than it popping on you with one throw. Surgery is pretty commonplace nowadays but the return rate is still over a year. Strider tore his UCL while at Clemson in 2019 and had TJ so this won't be anything new to him. This new breed of pitchers is really the first generation of the 'travel all-stars' who were brought up on 9-12 months per year baseball with likely a lot of bad instruction at those lower levels. There are pitch counts and rest requirements at the high school level now but those are self-policing (I'm not counting a starter's pitches while calling a game, that's on the coaches) and coaches have gotten in trouble for breaking those rules (a friend who was a HS coach here was suspended 10 games last year for this). These kids' arms are getting overwrought too soon and leads to problems if they continue in a pitching career. Heck, I had a sophomore in a JV game earlier this season break a bone in his arm after delivering a pitch. That shouldn't happen.

Interesting Twitter thread by ex-mlb pitcher on the subject:

https://x.com/robertstock6/status/17771 ... laxkEJhGJg

Couldn't agree more

I believe it's more of a wear & tear thing than it popping on you with one throw. Surgery is pretty commonplace nowadays but the return rate is still over a year. Strider tore his UCL while at Clemson in 2019 and had TJ so this won't be anything new to him. This new breed of pitchers is really the first generation of the 'travel all-stars' who were brought up on 9-12 months per year baseball with likely a lot of bad instruction at those lower levels. There are pitch counts and rest requirements at the high school level now but those are self-policing (I'm not counting a starter's pitches while calling a game, that's on the coaches) and coaches have gotten in trouble for breaking those rules (a friend who was a HS coach here was suspended 10 games last year for this). These kids' arms are getting overwrought too soon and leads to problems if they continue in a pitching career. Heck, I had a sophomore in a JV game earlier this season break a bone in his arm after delivering a pitch. That shouldn't happen.

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