Star Wars discussion (SPOILERS INCLUDED)

Postby **DigitalGypsy66** » Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:49 am

I'm ready. Why is Obi-wan small near the end of the clip? I thought it might be Kanan...but it's definitely a bearded Jedi.

Postby **nocera** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:50 am

I still really like The Force Awakens. Although it's the first of the series that is really hurt by watching in episode order. The biggest job TFA has is reminding us why we love Star Wars and making us forget about the **** prequels, which was the last Star Wars we saw. That's why it's basically a remake of ANH. Watching it directly after the OT makes it feel a bit redundant but it's still a super fun watch. When I do a final ranking after my re-watch, it'll likely be near the top of the list.

Postby **eddy** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:06 pm

Postby **tifosi77** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:23 pm

So that's it..... that's how they explain how thousands of ISDs were crewed in secret?

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:42 pm

They were better off not giving an explanation.

Postby **Sam's Drunk Dog** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:51 am

The full script of Colin Trevorrow’s Star Wars: Episode IX is supposedly available online.

https://winteriscoming.net/2020/02/16/c ... the-fates/

Much of it is a huge improvement over what we got but I don't care for the Tor Valum story and Rey using the dark side of the force.

Postby **nocera** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:00 am

I like the idea of bringing Coruscant back. It was such a huge part of the prequels and the rise of the Empire. Actually, why the **** wasn't Coruscant the planet that was destroyed by Starkiller Base in TFA? Instead it's some other city planet that we've never heard of.

Postby **nocera** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:14 am

By the way, this ending from the confirmed script leak is absolutely awful and the reason why you shouldn't take concept art and that script summary too seriously.

That's worse than anything in the ST. Also, so much of that script and even JJ's script relied on Carrie Fisher. The impact her death had on Ep 9 shouldn't be overlooked.

Postby **Spangler** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:33 pm

I like the idea of bringing Coruscant back. It was such a huge part of the prequels and the rise of the Empire. Actually, why the **** wasn't Coruscant the planet that was destroyed by Starkiller Base in TFA? Instead it's some other city planet that we've never heard of.

I think I read a few years back that JJ wanted it to be Coruscant and it was supposed to be Coruscant, but Kennedy and/or Disney shut it down.

Postby **Jim** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:55 pm

Weren't they (aren't they) going to do a series that takes place in lower levels of Coruscant? Not able to do that if lens-flare blows it up.

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:26 pm

That Treverrow movie would be 6 hours long.

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:41 pm

That Treverrow movie would be 6 hours long.

I think this was always going to be a problem with IX. TLJ (which I liked and you didn't but whatever) opened up too many new cans of worms for a penultimate entry. Even JJ's desired version of TROS was 3 hours. There was too much to wrap up in a single movie, which is what happens when you don't plan **** from the beginning Kathleen Kennedy. If it wasn't for the issues of actor contracts, getting this **** to theater as quickly as possible, and the desired three trilogy series (It's like poetry, sort of. They rhyme.), the logical move would have been two movies post TLJ, ending with a ten film saga that is better watched in separate parts because none of it flows together that well.

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:42 pm

That Treverrow movie would be 6 hours long.
I think this was always going to be a problem with IX. TLJ (which I liked and you didn't but whatever) opened up too many new cans of worms for penultimate entry. Even JJ's desired version of TROS was 3 hours. There was too much to wrap up in a single movie, which is what happens when you don't plan **** from the beginning Kathleen Kennedy. If it wasn't for the issues of actor contracts, getting this **** to theater as quickly as possible, and the desire three trilogy series (It's like poetry, sort of. They rhyme.), the logical move would have been two movies post TLJ, ending with a ten film saga that is better watched in separate parts because none of it flows together that well.

I agree with all of this.

Postby **tifosi77** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:29 pm

Filming for TFA started in February 2014, Rian Johnson was hired like three or four months later. The decision to kill off Snoke in the middle act was one of the first writing decisions he made, because they needed to break the Vader-Emperor dynamic and set Kylo Ren up as someone with agency over his actions. Each of the filmmakers collaborated with each other well in advance: JJ worked with Johnson developing the EpVIII story, Johnson worked with Trevorrow (and subsequently JJ again) developing EpIX. There was none of this "Johnson did what?!?!?1!!?111" nonsense everyone is blagging on about, no one was surprised by anything. The only movie that was really hamstrung once its development was well along was EpIX, and what caused issues were Carrie Fisher's untimely death, and fan butthurt over EpVIII.

(Fun fact: Johnson is the only writer-director on the post-Disney SW films to have seen his film through from start to finish. All the others have had changes made at one or the other position - or both - during development/production)

Postby **nocera** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:37 pm

I loved the decision to kill Snoke. That was spot on. I think the problem was that was just one of the many ways TLJ completely blew off everything set up in TFA. Snoke, the mystery of Rey's parents, Luke tossing the lightsaber. It felt like a middle finger to TFA and in turn TRoS felt like another middle finger to TLJ.

Postby **MR25** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:47 pm

How do we know that Rey being told her parents were nobodies wasn't just a ploy to try and break her down?

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:48 pm

I loved the decision to kill Snoke. That was spot on. I think the problem was that was just one of the many ways TLJ completely blew off everything set up in TFA. Snoke, the mystery of Rey's parents, Luke tossing the lightsaber. It felt like a middle finger to TFA and in turn TRoS felt like another middle finger to TLJ.

Postby **tifosi77** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:42 pm

Postby **tifosi77** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:53 pm

The way I have looked at it more or less from day one is the first four words of the TFA crawl are the key to essentially the entire sequel trilogy. If you buy into that conceit, then all that follows must make sense from a character point of view for that to pay off. "Luke Skywalker has vanished". What would get him to vanish? Is he in hiding? Is he doing what Yoda did after Order 66?

I buy into the direction of the character, and feel the saber toss made perfect sense if you look at it from the perspective of justifying his off-screen actions (story-wise). It also gives him an actual arc as a character - if you don't put him in a position where he's sort of lost faith in the Light, or at least in his own ability to remain in the Light, then what do you have him do for these new stories? Where does he start and finish? That's why the only thing I didn't really sign on for with that Freddie Prinze Jr rant a few months ago was the notion of "there are no 'gray' Jedis". It makes Luke far more interesting that he lost faith and found it again.

If you buy into the notion of the Force that you don't need special blood to be a Jedi, the it doesn't matter who Rey's parents are. It would've made her a more interesting character if she truly was a Nobody, because it's a much more powerful and satisfying story when the Nobodies defeat the Big Bads at the end, including the guy who actually is a Somebody. Rebellions are built on hope, but that hope is not "Gee, I hope we find an ally with that special bloodline, otherwise we're effed in the A."

Postby **nocera** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:09 pm

I like that Luke has lost faith. He shouldn’t immediately be best buds with Rey and accept his role in the resistance. But the saber toss was deliberately cartoonish. Not to mention followed soon after by him milking and drinking milk from the tit of an alien.

Postby **tifosi77** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:11 pm

The all-time best response to that was after TFA came out and just... ended on an actual cliffhanger, the meme that said, "There was also a hand. Did you bring the hand?"

Postby **nocera** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:18 pm

The all-time best response to that was after TFA came out and just... ended on an actual cliffhanger, the meme that said, "There was also a hand. Did you bring the hand?"

The saber toss is the exact same tone. It’s slapstick.

Postby **nocera** » Fri Feb 21, 2020 2:51 pm

After rewatching TLJ for the first time since theaters, my stance on it has changed a bit. I was always a big defender. And while there are still aspects of it that are great, there are far more aspects of it that are bad. It has some great ideas but the execution of most of those ideas is trash. It'll show something interesting but immediately undercut it with a bad joke. Like Rey practicing with Luke's saber for the first time and losing control, slicing the rock immediately undercut by the weird caretakers. Now, it's not nearly as bad as the neckbeards would have you believe but it is a pretty rough watch. It's probably my least favorite of the Disney era.

Postby **eddy** » Fri Feb 21, 2020 2:53 pm

interesting. I seem to like TLJ more and more every time I watch it...

Postby **nocera** » Fri Feb 21, 2020 3:03 pm

I mean even a bad Disney-era Star Wars is a million times better than anything from the prequels. The throne room fight is awesome. And I love that it returns the Force to something everybody can tap into, regardless of your blood.