5AF's 2018-19 Premier Pittsburgh Super Panthers Football Thread (and Basketball)

[willeyeam]

imo Pitt needs to put together a few 8-10 win seasons to improve recruiting, especially locally.. a new coach isn't going to come in and convince area kids that anything is different and Pitt is a prime destination until it actually happens. I'd obviously like to see Duzz do better around here, but it's an uphill battle given the last ten years

pitt is getting boatraced in local recruiting. even when they aren't competing against the big boys, guys still don't want to go to pitt. being useless in local recruiting has nothing to do with a lack of 8 to 10 win seasons

note: this is not to suggest that local recruiting is not the be all end all of the program

yes and no. Pitt got Gipson and Wright this year. 5 local recruits last year, 5 the year before including Ford.. I think it's very magnified when they lose one from home vs a kid from FL. Most of the ones they are losing are to OSU, ND and UPS.. 4-5 star kids that if they weren't from the area, no one would ever expect Pitt to have a shot at in the first place. Losing one to UK is different and hurts a little more. Obviously I'd like to keep most of these kids home at Pitt, but until they start winning and getting more than 40K to Heinz, these 4-5 star kids are going to want to play elsewhere.

[willeyeam]

I mean let's discuss the ones that the Pitt Super Panther Fanbase wishes we got:

Sanders (5 star #21 recruit in the US of A)
Wade (4 star #43 in the country)
Devonshire (4 star)
Kristofic (4 star)
David Adams (4 star)
Jurkovec (4 star top 100)
Jeter (4 star)

Ford is probably the only local comparable we got in this timeframe, with Whitehead a Chryst/Duzz combo recruiting pickup. Say 1.5 out of 9 for Duzz. That's probably around the success rate on 4-5 stars anywhere for Pitt, and won't change until they make a jump on the field.

[slappybrown]

I mean let's discuss the ones that the Pitt Super Panther Fanbase wishes we got:

Sanders (5 star #21 recruit in the US of A)
Wade (4 star #43 in the country)
Devonshire (4 star)
Kristofic (4 star)
David Adams (4 star)
Jurkovec (4 star top 100)
Jeter (4 star)

Ford is probably the only local comparable we got in this timeframe, with Whitehead a Chryst/Duzz combo recruiting pickup. Say 1.5 out of 9 for Duzz. That's probably around the success rate on 4-5 stars anywhere for Pitt, and won't change until they make a jump on the field.

I don't know, they did way better with Wanny at a time that the WPIAL/PA as a whole had a much better and deeper recruiting pool, particularly 4/5 stars.

Big picture it matters less compared to 10, let alone 20, years ago because the talent and population isn't where it used to be by a significant degree. On the other hand, given how difficult it is right now for them to get 4-5 stars from outside a 100-mile radius of Oakland, those few that are there he has to keep here. I know its chicken and egg and all that, but you've two options:

1) Be a Wanny-caliber recruiter/staff who is so good at it that he basically recruited on par in-state with UPS/Paterno at a time when JoePa was still winning double digit games (Narduzzi is obviously not this)

2) Build a program infrastructure that can successfully develop the specific players that you recruit and identify as the right fit for your program even if those recruits are not necessarily valued by other programs in the same way. This is the Wisky/OK State model, where you can consistently hit double digit wins despite recruiting in the 30s and 40s, which is exactly where Narduzzi is.

Jury is still out on #2 and every time I think "I've seen enough, Dickie Dunn and his insane rants are more correct than not" they do something like trample the entire division, turn around what looked to be a disasterous season, and win the Coastal. Which in turn led to them finishing the season by getting blown off the field in Miami, trotting out the single worst passing performance I think I have ever seen against Clemson, and then the Sun Bowl which I don't want to talk about and never will talk about, which tells me they probably didn't turn anything around.

[willeyeam]

Wanny was recruiting coming off 4 straight seasons in the top 25 and a Fiesta Bowl appearance. I thank you for proving my point. We will recruit well in the area when we win some damn games

to add: the 4 seasons prior to Wanny taking over - UPS won 5, 9, 3 and 4 games per year. This is apples and oranges compared to today. Wanny was in charge of a clearly superior program heading into 2005

[slappybrown]

Wanny was recruiting coming off 4 straight seasons in the top 25 and a Fiesta Bowl appearance. I thank you for proving my point. We will recruit well in the area when we win some damn games

What are you talking about chief

Wanny went 5-7 the year he got 4 4/5 stars from the WPIAL (the Baldwin class in Feb 08). HIs first winning season was year 4, in the fall of 08.

Wanny Year 1 2005 - 5-6
2006 - 6-6
2007 - 5-7

Yes, he was really blowing the doors off the place. The Fiesta Bowl his predecessor coached in was an 8-4 team that got shellacked by Utah as you know. He had a losing record and was on the hot seat and still got nearly every big recruit in the WPIAL in 08 with Pryor being the big exception.

Muttering "WIN MOAR" as an excuse for recruiting 5 years in is meaningless

[willeyeam]

Wanny was recruiting coming off 4 straight seasons in the top 25 and a Fiesta Bowl appearance. I thank you for proving my point. We will recruit well in the area when we win some damn games

Muttering "WIN MOAR" as an excuse for recruiting 5 years in is meaningless

I agree. The issue is on the field, is my point.

[slappybrown]

But the point is that in the very recent past a HC at the same program demonstrated that you can get a majority of those high-ranked local kids to stay home despite poor on-field results if you're good at recruiting. Which is why this:

That's probably around the success rate on 4-5 stars anywhere for Pitt, and won't change until they make a jump on the field.

Doesn't really carry much weight for me.

[MrKennethTKangaroo]

i do think there are a lot of big-picture reasons why recruiting is more of a nationwide thing than it was before. social media, hudl, 300 different channels airing games on 5 days a week, etc.

I don't know how this impacts pitt and the wpial, but even when pitt was at low points, there were at least a handful of top end guys that would be interested in going to pitt. now, only the 5th or 6th best guys in the wpial are interested in pitt.

I get that a certain number of dudes are going to be like krisofic or jurkovec and just want to play for notre dame. that isn't going to ever change. but to have Kentucky just show up and take a guy from pitt? that hurts.

[Dickie Dunn]

Anyone who wants to play for Notre Dame is a terrible person and should never be allowed back to the greater Pittsburgh area.

[willeyeam]

Devonshire hurt, there is no way around that. We went 0-2 on 4 or 5 stars in the WPIAL. Next year there's two 4 or 5 star in the state of PA. At the end of the day it's not the biggest deal in the world imo

[Freddy Rumsen]

Where Pitt’s recruiting finished in the ACC in Narduzzi’s four full classes

2016- 5th
2017- 7th
2018- 8th
2019- 10th

https://twitter.com/ChrisDokish/status/ ... 7173484544

[willeyeam]

not good

[meow]

If you’re not first, you’re last

[Dickie Dunn]

Where Pitt’s recruiting finished in the ACC in Narduzzi’s four full classes

2016- 5th
2017- 7th
2018- 8th
2019- 10th

https://twitter.com/ChrisDokish/status/ ... 7173484544

24/7's is even worse:

2016 - 4th
2017 - 7th
2018 - 8th
2019 - 12th

[Freddy Rumsen]

#Pitt coach Pat Narduzzi: "I want guys that love Pittsburgh, okay, and that's what it comes down to. You either love Pittsburgh and you want to stay here and play for your city or you don't. And if you don't, I'm good. We wouldn't win with you anyway. It's beautiful."

https://twitter.com/PantherLair/status/ ... 15488?s=19

[Dickie Dunn]

@FieldYates

Source: the Chiefs are expected to hire University of Kentucky defensive coordinator Matt House as their linebackers coach.

[willeyeam]

lol

[NAN]

#Pitt coach Pat Narduzzi: "I want guys that love Pittsburgh, okay, and that's what it comes down to. You either love Pittsburgh and you want to stay here and play for your city or you don't. And if you don't, I'm good. We wouldn't win with you anyway. It's beautiful."

https://twitter.com/PantherLair/status/ ... 15488?s=19

Now this quote does not help him. I saw the Quip coach tweeted he was pissed at Pitt fans and Narduzzi for how they handled Devonshire.

Narduzzi tweeting out the class is done before Devonshires announcement, I'm fine with that. Narduzzi has no obligation to the kid.

Him calling out the kid though and saying they wouldn't win with him during the press conference is over the line IMO. And that is going to hurt future kids he is trying to recruit from the area.

[willeyeam]

meh the Quip coach that tweeted is Devonshire's cousin I think.

It will hurt recruiting the kids that don't want to be here and help recruit the ones that do want to be here. Probably shouldn't have said it, but whatev. Duzz has his with us or against us mentality and it seems that everyone that plays for him is okay with it. I mean you have a Pitt commit from Aliquippa that quoted Duzz's tweet about completing signing day and saying "gangs all here." I think it just gets a little blown out of proportion and we'll forget it happened by the time Spring practice starts

[MrKennethTKangaroo]

Nardog is the worst in pgh sports when it comes to handling the media.

1. Capel
2. Sully






3. Hurdle
4. Tomlin










5. Narduzzi

[willeyeam]

eh I think Hurdle is pretty decent at it. Doesn't he email them all a quote he finds every day? Either way yes, Narduzzi doesn't do himself any favors there. They're mostly all amateur hour but you need to be the bigger man and deal with that

[Dickie Dunn]

Ollison is Pitt's only participant in the combine which is crazy because Hall is the better RB.

[MrKennethTKangaroo]

hall definitely has more upside in the NFL

[Freddy Rumsen]

Ugh...Pitt.

[willeyeam]

Hosed on two straight calls. Missed both though BALL DONT LIE