Politics And Current Events

MWB
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Postby MWB » Mon Jun 05, 2023 9:53 am

I think part of it may be the female to male transition is less shocking to some people. And there’s also the thinking by a fairly large group that a man should be strong, dominant, in charge… all that. The kind of man boebert is raising her sons to be. So others find it more offensive when people don’t fit into that mold. It’s more commonly accepted for a woman to be a “tomboy,” so it’s not as scary to some. I think that might be a part of why the m to f gets more attention.

Troy Loney
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Postby Troy Loney » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:04 am

I mean, I will fully admit, and I've spoke about it here, I have my reservations about the sports aspect, for male to female. And I can see the legal ramifications that Shyster laid out. But as for every day life, I could care less.

Like c2i said, I personally don't know anyone who transitioned, but I encounter a lot of people, and if I did meet someone that transitioned, I didn't even notice, nor would I care.

But I literally hear nothing about female to male.
What "legal ramifications"

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Postby Troy Loney » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:08 am

I think the sports thing is definitely the only wedge issue I can really get my head around.

I would agree with the keep sports separate sentiment for the most party, at least up to high school. I think for younger kids, just let them play sports and not have to fight culture wars about it. But yeah, when you're in high school and college, you should be a mostly formed person and understand why there would be restrictions on where you compete.

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Postby nocera » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:08 am

My cousin is female to male. The majority of the family was supportive (and still is) but a few people lost it when he had his top surgery. That was the moment they went from “I don’t get it but sure whatever she wants” to “this is horrible how could she?!”

Those people still use his old name and pronouns also, though don’t do it to his face. Somehow they think that makes it okay.

NAN
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Postby NAN » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:30 am

I mean, I will fully admit, and I've spoke about it here, I have my reservations about the sports aspect, for male to female. And I can see the legal ramifications that Shyster laid out. But as for every day life, I could care less.

Like c2i said, I personally don't know anyone who transitioned, but I encounter a lot of people, and if I did meet someone that transitioned, I didn't even notice, nor would I care.

But I literally hear nothing about female to male.
What "legal ramifications"

From Shyster below, there would have to be changes to the law, but as they are currently set up, it can cause issues:

Second, it matters because there are tangible legal distinctions between men and women and legal protections and rights for women. In many cases, women had to fight for years to obtain those rights and protections. Example: in many cases, government contracting gives a bonus for proposers who are "minority owned businesses," and the definition of a minority usually includes women. Women and other minorities fought hard for that treatment. When those rules first went into place, men would get around them by putting their businesses in their wives' names so they could claim "woman owned" status. Government pretty quickly wised up and started to require proof that the woman was actually involved in the business. But if "woman" is just a matter of personal self-identification, why can't Bob the Builder just "identify" as a woman and claim that status? By reducing "woman" to nothing more than some sort of feeling, the trans movement is erasing literally decades of feminist efforts to secure to women their own sports, spaces, and interests.

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Postby Troy Loney » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:39 am

Sure, if Bob from Bob's appliance wants a tax break for changing his name to Bobbina, let him have it.

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Postby count2infinity » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:45 am

If only a trans person would be considered a marginalized minority and could just obtain the rights and protections that other minority groups have fought for...

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Postby NAN » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:49 am

If only a trans person would be considered a marginalized minority and could just obtain the rights and protections that other minority groups have fought for...
I think that is a different conversation and legit, and we need to look at trans individuals being included in minority groups (I'm assuming you would have to set when a person is truly considered "trans").

It's how it is currently constructed, with Troys response, that is the concern, and it marginalizes the laws out there.

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Postby Troy Loney » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:52 am



It's how it is currently constructed, with Troys response, that is the concern, and it marginalizes the laws out there.
:?:

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Postby count2infinity » Mon Jun 05, 2023 10:57 am

It's a little odd for shyster to be arguing that point as he most likely does not believe such "rights and protects" like "a bonus for proposers who are 'minority owned businesses'" should even exist in the first place...

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:54 pm

This is what work from home culture creates
Woke from home
This went an entire page without being recognized, but I want you to know that I hear you, Ronald. :fist:

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Postby tifosi77 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:55 pm

If only a trans person would be considered a marginalized minority and could just obtain the rights and protections that other minority groups have fought for...
This was the first thing that popped into my mind, too. :lol:

There's a preeeeetty easy solution available to address that concern here, folks.

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Postby CBear3 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:55 pm

I think the government recognizing you as a man or woman must achieve some threshold, rather than just deciding to change your pronouns.

faftorial
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Postby faftorial » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:58 pm

I think the government recognizing you as a man or woman must achieve some threshold, rather than just deciding to change your pronouns.
Haven't people changed their sex on their birth certificate? That seems official.

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Postby tifosi77 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:59 pm

This is probably a far broader discussion, but........... what is the purpose/need for such a recognition from the government? We talked about 'minority' classification because of historic trends in certain professional contexts, but chicks outnumber dudes. So the status is situational.

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Postby tifosi77 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 5:24 pm

But tacking on to that point, so that we have a clear understanding of the scope of the problem that is so vexing to conservatives.

How Many Transgender Athletes Play Women's Sports?
Of the estimated 332 million citizens living in the United States, 1.3 million adults and 300,000 youth ages 13 to 17 identify as transgender, equaling half a percent and 1.4 percent of the population respectively, according to a report published by Williams Institute, a think tank at UCLA's Law School in 2022.

Not all transgender people identify as women, and an even smaller number consists of transgender women hoping to compete in girls' and women's sports.

Privacy laws make it tough to identify the exact number of transgender athletes competing in public school sports, but researcher and medical physicist Joanna Harper estimates the number can't exceed 100 nationwide.

"While we don't know the exact number of trans women competing in NCAA sports, I would be very surprised if there were more than 100 of them in the women's category," Harper told Newsweek.

One hundred transgender athletes would comprise an incredibly small number of the U.S. population, and the number dwindles even further when it comes to middle school and high school athletes.
Nikki Haley recently stated that participation of trans women in athletics was "the women’s issue of our time", and “[h]ow are we supposed to get our girls used to the fact that biological boys are in their locker room? And then we wonder why a third of our teenage girls seriously contemplated suicide last year."

100 people are causing this.

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Postby dodint » Mon Jun 05, 2023 5:26 pm

It only takes 1 trans athlete per discipline to completely erase the efforts of an entire nations class of girls, though. It's an incredibly outsized impact.

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Postby CBear3 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 5:32 pm

It only takes 1 trans athlete per discipline to completely erase the efforts of an entire nations class of girls, though. It's an incredibly outsized impact.
But does it really?
One trans woman won an event (out of 16) at the NCAA swimming championships. Did it erase the efforts of everybody other woman swimmer in college? Did it even erase the efforts of every 500m freestyler?

And on top of that, FINA has changed their rules to address it going forward.
Let the sports agencies handle it, and keep the politicians out of it.

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Postby MalkinIsMyHomeboy » Mon Jun 05, 2023 5:48 pm

It only takes 1 trans athlete per discipline to completely erase the efforts of an entire nations class of girls, though. It's an incredibly outsized impact.
I think you’re overestimating how many trans athlete compete at a very high level in female sports


you hear about the Lia Thomas stories and whatnot but they’re all pretty rare

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Postby Viva la Ben » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:09 pm

HOW CAN DOJ POSSIBLY CHARGE ME, WHO DID NOTHING WRONG, WHEN NO OTHER PRESIDENT’S WERE CHARGED, WHEN JOE BIDEN WON’T BE CHARGED FOR ANYTHING, INCLUDING THE FACT THAT HE HAS 1,850 BOXES, MUCH OF IT CLASSIFIED, AND SOME DATING BACK TO HIS SENATE DAY WHEN EVEN DEMOCRAT SENATORS ARE SHOCKED. ALSO, PRESIDENT CLINTON HAD DOCUMENTS, AND WON IN COURT. CROOKED HILLARY DELETED 33,000 EMAILS, MANY CLASSIFIED, AND WASN’T EVEN CLOSE TO BEING CHARGED! ONLY TRUMP - THE GREATEST WITCH HUNT OF ALL TIME!

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Postby faftorial » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:20 pm



Nikki Haley recently stated that participation of trans women in athletics was "the women’s issue of our time", and “[h]ow are we supposed to get our girls used to the fact that biological boys are in their locker room? And then we wonder why a third of our teenage girls seriously contemplated suicide last year."

WTF

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Postby Gaucho » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:23 pm



Image

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Postby NTP66 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:25 pm

Lol, all that does is make us believe it happened even more now.

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:55 pm



Nikki Haley recently stated that participation of trans women in athletics was "the women’s issue of our time", and “[h]ow are we supposed to get our girls used to the fact that biological boys are in their locker room? And then we wonder why a third of our teenage girls seriously contemplated suicide last year."

WTF
I don't have the CDC data handy, but even if we go with this as an accurate number, the correlation between that suicidal ideation and trans ladypeople doing sportsballs is almost too stupid to be offensive.

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Postby tifosi77 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:56 pm

Effortful grunting is a good way to describe whatever it is that's happened to Shyster.

;)

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