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Willie Kool
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Postby Willie Kool » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:52 pm

Your theory seems more like Oliver than Roger.
https://twitter.com/TomArnold/status/938600824866881536
I’m disappointed with my friend Leeann Tweedon. Her partner at KABC John Phillips is a Roger Stone pal & they coached her for weeks to bring Al Franken down. I’d hoped she’d use her voice to speak out for all women again predators like Roy Moore & Donald Trump but she’s a birther

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:55 pm

I can't speak to the Stone connection, but John Phillips is a first rate tool.

But if you're going to make a statement like that, at least spell the person's name right.

Freddy Rumsen
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Postby Freddy Rumsen » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 pm

So, by precedent, the GOP will deny the allegations and then expect the Democrat to resign.
Tim Murphy resigned a couple months ago, and there have been plenty of calls by GOP folks for Roy Moore to step aside.
Not sure how the Tim Murphy situation fits in. I thought that had more to do with his brazen hypocrisy.
It's a sexual scandal involving a GOP congressman that resigned.

Your naked partisanship (no pun intended) notwithstanding it took forevor for Dems to call out Conyers and Franken.

The Senate GOP has been outspoken in calling on Moore to drop out.

Willie Kool
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Postby Willie Kool » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:56 pm

So, by precedent, the GOP will deny the allegations and then expect the Democrat to resign.
Actually, the GOP will deny and then sit back and watch the Democrats tear each other apart.

After all, this is where the average GOP/Trump voter is on the issue:
Image

MR25
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Postby MR25 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:57 pm

So, by precedent, the GOP will deny the allegations and then expect the Democrat to resign.
Tim Murphy resigned a couple months ago, and there have been plenty of calls by GOP folks for Roy Moore to step aside.
Not sure how the Tim Murphy situation fits in. I thought that had more to do with his brazen hypocrisy.
It's a sexual scandal involving a GOP congressman that resigned.

Your naked partisanship (no pun intended) notwithstanding it took forevor for Dems to call out Conyers and Franken.

The Senate GOP has been outspoken in calling on Moore to drop out.

Asking a mistress to have an abortion = sexual assault.


Ok.

Troy Loney
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Postby Troy Loney » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:58 pm

Conflation nation

MR25
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Postby MR25 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 2:59 pm

But then again, I guess that's what my point with the Moore-boy hypothetical was getting to:

GOP don't really care about women. They only care if it's something that will make them look bad based on their views (anti-gay, anti-abortion, etc).

Freddy Rumsen
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Postby Freddy Rumsen » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:01 pm

So, by precedent, the GOP will deny the allegations and then expect the Democrat to resign.
Actually, the GOP will deny and then sit back and watch the Democrats tear each other apart.

After all, this is where the average GOP/Trump voter is on the issue:
Image
You mean like this?
In a 1998 essay for Mirabella, Burleigh described an occasion aboard Air Force One when she noticed President Bill Clinton apparently looking at her legs. The piece led to her being described as "the Ally McBeal of former White House reporters" by columnist Ellen Goodman. Approached by a Washington Post media reporter to discuss the Mirabella article, Burleigh stated, “I would be happy to give him a blowjob just to thank him for keeping abortion legal. I think American women should be lining up with their Presidential kneepads on to show their gratitude for keeping the theocracy off our backs.”
https://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/washington ... r%20Hearts

Troy Loney
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Postby Troy Loney » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:03 pm

I think it's clear that being a predator is a male thing, independent of party affiliation. The only question right now is whether those being accused will be held accountable.

Freddy Rumsen
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Postby Freddy Rumsen » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:05 pm

This idea that the Democrats are any more "pro woman" on the sexual harassment issue right now is just laughably partisan.

Nancy Pelosi was on Meet the Press last week defending Conyers, who had multiple sexual harassment accusations at that time.

Willie Kool
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Postby Willie Kool » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:07 pm

20 years ago = today.

Congrats Freddy, that's a first class grunty.

MR25
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Postby MR25 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:07 pm

I like that that's what you took out of my post, and not the whole "Only care if it makes them look bad" thing.

I'm saying the GOP is laughably bad. I'm not saying Dems are good.

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:13 pm

As regards issues of harassment, where we are as a society today is not the same place we were just a week ago, which is not the same place we were six months ago, which is not the same place as a year ago.

Here's a question for all to ponder: Accepting that the Access Hollywood tape is part of what got the ball rolling on this front, pretend for a moment that the election were post-#metoo. Do you think it would've played a bigger role in the outcome? Do you think the GOP would've been more vocal in its response to their nominee's stated actions? Similarly, how do you think the Bill Clinton stuff would play out in a post-#metoo world?

grunthy
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Postby grunthy » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:18 pm

As regards issues of harassment, where we are as a society today is not the same place we were just a week ago, which is not the same place we were six months ago, which is not the same place as a year ago.

Here's a question for all to ponder: Accepting that the Access Hollywood tape is part of what got the ball rolling on this front, pretend for a moment that the election were post-#metoo. Do you think it would've played a bigger role in the outcome? Do you think the GOP would've been more vocal in its response to their nominee's stated actions? Similarly, how do you think the Bill Clinton stuff would play out in a post-#metoo world?
Probably use the same excuse they gave Conyers. He did a lot of good and thank him for his service.

shmenguin
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Postby shmenguin » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:19 pm

regarding moore, i imagine this is the inner monologue for the GOP:

Image

they know moore is awful, and prior to 13 months ago, they probably assumed their voter bases would have agreed. but now...you have a tricky situation where there's 30% of the public who are die hard trump fanatics. which is a surprise. and not only that, but the election also demonstrated that the pathological republican is a stronger entity than anyone imagined.

so then this moore thing comes up, and these guys are legit baffled about what stance to take. he's republican and he's endorsed by trump. go against that, and what kind of blow back is there? maybe a lot. maybe only a little. but they have thumbs up butts in the meantime. what a time to be alive.

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:22 pm

As regards issues of harassment, where we are as a society today is not the same place we were just a week ago, which is not the same place we were six months ago, which is not the same place as a year ago.

Here's a question for all to ponder: Accepting that the Access Hollywood tape is part of what got the ball rolling on this front, pretend for a moment that the election were post-#metoo. Do you think it would've played a bigger role in the outcome? Do you think the GOP would've been more vocal in its response to their nominee's stated actions? Similarly, how do you think the Bill Clinton stuff would play out in a post-#metoo world?
Probably use the same excuse they gave Conyers. He did a lot of good and thank him for his service.
Things have changed in the past week. Conyers is gone. Pelosi's call for him to resign may have had all the sincerity of an Oscar loser clapping after their name wasn't called, but the call was made, and he's out.

shmenguin
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Postby shmenguin » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:27 pm

This idea that the Democrats are any more "pro woman" on the sexual harassment issue right now is just laughably partisan.

Nancy Pelosi was on Meet the Press last week defending Conyers, who had multiple sexual harassment accusations at that time.
i don't think there's a significant difference between the righties and lefties on capital hill on this issue. their voters are a different story, of course.

with that said, i do acknowledge that a democrat in 1998 was not a gentleman. and lots of people did vote for him.

grunthy
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Postby grunthy » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:27 pm

As regards issues of harassment, where we are as a society today is not the same place we were just a week ago, which is not the same place we were six months ago, which is not the same place as a year ago.

Here's a question for all to ponder: Accepting that the Access Hollywood tape is part of what got the ball rolling on this front, pretend for a moment that the election were post-#metoo. Do you think it would've played a bigger role in the outcome? Do you think the GOP would've been more vocal in its response to their nominee's stated actions? Similarly, how do you think the Bill Clinton stuff would play out in a post-#metoo world?
Probably use the same excuse they gave Conyers. He did a lot of good and thank him for his service.
Things have changed in the past week. Conyers is gone. Pelosi's call for him to resign may have had all the sincerity of an Oscar loser clapping after their name wasn't called, but the call was made, and he's out.

I wonder if they’ll hug, kiss and cry for every one of their members accused or convicted of harassment?

Willie Kool
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Postby Willie Kool » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:27 pm

And for those questioning my defense of Franken, you'll notice I didn't say one word about the Conyers allegations.

Freddy Rumsen
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Postby Freddy Rumsen » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:29 pm

http://www.weeklystandard.com/article/2010758/

Weekly Standard publishes Gardner's NRSC letter unequivocally condemning Moore.

Troy Loney
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Postby Troy Loney » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:30 pm



I wonder if they’ll hug, kiss and cry for every one of their members accused or convicted of harassment?

I wonder if Trump and his prize offspring will do twitter victory laps every time a democrat gets accused.

Troy Loney
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Postby Troy Loney » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:31 pm

http://www.weeklystandard.com/article/2010758/

Weekly Standard publishes Gardner's NRSC letter unequivocally condemning Moore.
That's sweet, but will they consider expelling him if he refused to step down.

columbia
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Postby columbia » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:53 pm

What's the meta-argument here?

Troy Loney
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Postby Troy Loney » Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:01 pm

What's the meta-argument here?
I think we're arguing in absolutes when the situation is too complex for it. On an objective surface level angle, the high profile Democrats are being pushed out. And while this is definitely all public pressure and against the wishes of people like Pelosi, it still happened. I think the Republican congressional leadership would have been happy to disown Moore and expel him, but they have a Trump problem. I think both parties have factions and sentiment within that are either positive or negative and trying to derive an actual value is fruitless.

ie, there are plenty of Republicans more principled than the average democrat, but unfortunately right now the most brazen moral offender is the de facto shot caller.

Factorial
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Postby Factorial » Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:30 pm

The favorite to win AF's senate seat in 2018: Rep. Keith Ellison.

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