Politics And Current Events

[MalkinIsMyHomeboy]

found this interesting

NPR: New Study Says White Police Officers Are Not More Likely To Shoot Minority Suspects

this **** is infinitely complex

[nocera]

Source of the post And what amazes me is it seems some of the same people that blasted the morons who brought their guns to the government building, albeit in a peaceful way because they were angry with the COVID restrictions, which were affecting their lives, are ok with this.

Imagine if the black lives matters protesting brought guns to a government building.

[MR25]

Source of the post And what amazes me is it seems some of the same people that blasted the morons who brought their guns to the government building, albeit in a peaceful way because they were angry with the COVID restrictions, which were affecting their lives, are ok with this.

Imagine if the black lives matters protesting brought guns to a government building.

That's assuming they even make it to the building.

[NAN]

Source of the post And what amazes me is it seems some of the same people that blasted the morons who brought their guns to the government building, albeit in a peaceful way because they were angry with the COVID restrictions, which were affecting their lives, are ok with this.

Imagine if the black lives matters protesting brought guns to a government building.

How it would be handled is a totally different topic, and I would agree with you that it would be handled differently most likely, which would be wrong IMO.

But we are not comparing that here.

[mikey]

How long has police brutality been a concern already though? And what systemic changes can we make that actually answer to these very real concerns...?

We're a reactive, knee-jerk society...any catastrophe that happens, we go into "holy ****" mode and string some garbage together (Patriot Act after 9/11, FDA after "The Jungle" [that one is just for Troy Loney...suck on that one, Troy haha])...

What do we do about this? The only thing that we just kind of do is marijuana legislation...because marijuana will never have an event. There will never be a headline that says, "Pot Prevents School Shooting" or anything...John Mulaney has a good bit about it, he goes something like...

"We just went up one day and said, 'Can we have some marijuana now?' and the government said, 'ok!' and then we said, 'can we treat gay people and brown people like actual humans?' and they said, 'we''ll think about it...' and we said, 'ok!'" and that was that...

This feels like one of the things that is getting really nothing done about it...and it's on a murder->riot->loot loop, which probably is a dangerous combination of things to keep on loop...

[nocera]

Source of the post And what amazes me is it seems some of the same people that blasted the morons who brought their guns to the government building, albeit in a peaceful way because they were angry with the COVID restrictions, which were affecting their lives, are ok with this.

Imagine if the black lives matters protesting brought guns to a government building.

How it would be handled is a totally different topic, and I would agree with you that it would be handled differently most likely, which would be wrong IMO.

But we are not comparing that here.

It's part of the inequality discussion, which is one of the major reasons for the of the protests in Minneapolis.

[nocera]

Source of the post How long has police brutality been a concern already though? And what systemic changes can we make that actually answer to these very real concerns...?

You can't address all of it at once. But, if you go case by case and actually stop "protecting your own" and convict those responsible, maybe a cop would think twice before stepping over the line.

[Freddy Rumsen]

So what have the governments in Minnesota been doing about it?

I mean you can't blame this on white Southerners.

Why is there such an inequality in a State like Minnesota and a city like Minneapolis?

[count2infinity]

I mean you can't blame this on white Southerners.

Is someone trying to?

[mikey]

Also, just to make sure I don't go full bleeding heart pinko here...I do believe that racism is incurable...but I believe that over time, by way of attrition and what not, will gradually recede...women didn't get the right to vote til like a hundred years ago. Schools were segregated up until the 50's or 60's or whatever...didn't some third party presidential candidate want segregation to return and won a bunch of states in the south in like 1968 or something uncomfortably recent...? I forget things...anyway...I don't expect the CRA of '68 to cure racism or cure inequality or any unicorn fable utopia nonsense like that...I get things take time to evolve in society...

That said, part of that evolution probably shouldn't include an excess of government agents killing its citizens in unjust situations...I doubt that's on the checklist towards success...

[willeyeam]

Would any "systematic change" happen if they peacefully protested?

I think we're all in agreement that blowing up the city is bad. But, maybe that's what they think they have to do to get actual change. I can't pretend to know what it's like

[Freddy Rumsen]

I mean you can't blame this on white Southerners.

Is someone trying to?

No, that was obviously not the point.

Minnesota, and Minneapolis especially, are pretty Progressive and accepting as can be seen by their excellent record in welcoming Hmong and Somali refugees.

Why then is there this obviously inequal justice when it comes to African-Americans in the same city?

[mikey]

Source of the post How long has police brutality been a concern already though? And what systemic changes can we make that actually answer to these very real concerns...?

You can't address all of it at once. But, if you go case by case and actually stop "protecting your own" and convict those responsible, maybe a cop would think twice before stepping over the line.

Sounds good, but I know that I couldn't do that readily. Different scope, but same precedent. If my teammate takes some cheap shot at an opponent and it starts a ruckus during a hockey game and I'm the closest one to the incident...guess what? I am required to grab the first - and therefore angriest - guy coming towards him and try to take him out. I can't just be like, "that's the guy right over there, sir...that's the guy you want" and wave him by me haha...

Is this a union issue? Is this an accountability issue? Where does that accountability lie? Is it those that prosecute, those that manage police officers, an ombudsman situation?

I'm not asking you to answer those questions specifically. But it's easy to say, "please be better"...but how and to what end? What's reasonable and actionable?

[grunthy]

Would any "systematic change" happen if they peacefully protested?

I think we're all in agreement that blowing up the city is bad. But, maybe that's what they think they have to do to get actual change. I can't pretend to know what it's like

Will blowing up your city get the change you want or will it cause change that will do more harm?

[nocera]

I'd like to believe that you would step in if you noticed your teammate literally killing somebody.

[mikey]

I think the point is to get a solution somehow...we can scratch off dumb things like writing a letter and voting...so, what else we got...?

[grunthy]

Would any "systematic change" happen if they peacefully protested?

I think we're all in agreement that blowing up the city is bad. But, maybe that's what they think they have to do to get actual change. I can't pretend to know what it's like

Where in the world has unorganized violence brought about good change from a government entity?

[mikey]

I'd like to believe that you would step in if you noticed your teammate literally killing somebody.

Yeah, but that's not congruent to scope. No one kills anyone on a hockey rink. By this logic, that would mean only officers would turn on each other for murders. But if you rough up some black folk, maybe sexually assault some woman types before throwing them in the drunk tank for the night, you'd be ok with them not coming forward because that's not on the worst end of the spectrum?

I know you're not intending that. But you can't expect teammates to turn on each other for every thing that is actually an injustice. They may turn here, I'd hope they would too. But that's not gonna be enough for things that fall below the level of: unjust murder caught on video.

[willeyeam]

Would any "systematic change" happen if they peacefully protested?

I think we're all in agreement that blowing up the city is bad. But, maybe that's what they think they have to do to get actual change. I can't pretend to know what it's like

Where in the world has unorganized violence brought about good change from a government entity?

I didn't say it would man

[MR25]

I mean you can't blame this on white Southerners.

Is someone trying to?

No, that was obviously not the point.

Minnesota, and Minneapolis especially, are pretty Progressive and accepting as can be seen by their excellent record in welcoming Hmong and Somali refugees.

Why then is there this obviously inequal justice when it comes to African-Americans in the same city?

Because the police are not a reflection of the people they serve?

[grunthy]

I'd like to believe that you would step in if you noticed your teammate literally killing somebody.

Yeah, but that's not congruent to scope. No one kills anyone on a hockey rink. By this logic, that would mean only officers would turn on each other for murders. But if you rough up some black folk, maybe sexually assault some woman types before throwing them in the drunk tank for the night, you'd be ok with them not coming forward because that's not on the worst end of the spectrum?

I know you're not intending that. But you can't expect teammates to turn on each other for every thing that is actually an injustice. They may turn here, I'd hope they would too. But that's not gonna be enough for things that fall below the level of: unjust murder caught on video.

Bertuzzi tried to...

[nocera]

I'd like to believe that you would step in if you noticed your teammate literally killing somebody.

Yeah, but that's not congruent to scope. No one kills anyone on a hockey rink. By this logic, that would mean only officers would turn on each other for murders. But if you rough up some black folk, maybe sexually assault some woman types before throwing them in the drunk tank for the night, you'd be ok with them not coming forward because that's not on the worst end of the spectrum?

I know you're not intending that. But you can't expect teammates to turn on each other for every thing that is actually an injustice. They may turn here, I'd hope they would too. But that's not gonna be enough for things that fall below the level of: unjust murder caught on video.

Okay, but it shouldn't be up to teammates to decide how far is too far. The commissioner of your league should step in and say, "hey guys, this isn't tolerated anymore and if you do it, your punishment is _____." The DA needs to prosecute and stop protecting cops just because they're cops.

[Freddy Rumsen]

I mean you can't blame this on white Southerners.

Is someone trying to?

No, that was obviously not the point.

Minnesota, and Minneapolis especially, are pretty Progressive and accepting as can be seen by their excellent record in welcoming Hmong and Somali refugees.

Why then is there this obviously inequal justice when it comes to African-Americans in the same city?

Because the police are not a reflection of the people they serve?

We all get that, but why are the politicians so unwilling in the same city to do anything about it?

Just see the story about Amy Klobuchar not prosecuting the same guy when he had a police brutality complaint on him 10 years ago.

[Troy Loney]

@Freddy Rumsen Is making a good point. I don’t really have an answer, but I am thinking it has something to do with disparate treatment versus disparate impact. We saw disparate treatment in that video, that’s easy for everyone to point at and draw conclusions. But the social contract that all of white america trusts and has bought into has disparate impact that requires a broad political consensus to alter. This is where you can’t separate policy and politics, elected officials have to rewrite those policies and would get crushed if they addressed those rules and directives that rich yuppie urban liberals depend on, and that’s why you can’t get any city to actually address the underlying root causes.

[MR25]

I touched on it earlier but I think it goes back to local/state PDs being too ingrained in the local/state government and the only way for real action to be taken is if something came down federally.