All Things Guns & Ammo

[mac5155]

My buddy went and bought a shot gun. I was looking at it. It's a browning Auto 5, NWTF Edition. Amazing he paid 750 for it. And it looks like it's a 1300 gun.

[Shyster]

I think Browning has always positioned itself a step above companies like Remington or Winchester in terms of being a premium product, and that certainly carries over to fit, finish, and wood. A lot of their guns are just flat-out gorgeous.

[mac5155]

That's what caught my eye. This guy doesn't usually buy nice guns. And I took ahold of it to see... And he didn't even realize what he had

[Shyster]

The number of registered gun owners in California has doubled since 2012.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/registere ... 31478.html

This data is interesting in that California is one of the places where it is most difficult to be a gun owner, with its assault-weapon bans, magazine bans, waiting periods, the restrictive handgun list, and the near impossibility of getting concealed-carry permits in many counties. If Californians are nonetheless jumping through all of those hoops to buy firearms, then this would indicate that the record sales of firearms in recent years are in fact going to many new owners and not just existing gun owners buying more guns.

[tifosi77]

Something else that may contribute to the increase in the number of 'registered' owners: A law was passed in 2016 that starting July 2018, if you owned a rifle/carbine with defined AW features (*sigh*) it had to be registered with DOJ. That's new. The story doesn't indicate one way or the other, but it wouldn't be surprising if there was a big spike in registrations from 2016-2018.

Once my ID's catch up with me, I'll be adding to the list. (I think I can get CA-compliant AR now, without the updated address info on my license, cos proof of residency is not a requirement - yet - for long guns. But I have to wait until my license reflects my actual residence to get a pistol. Because that's how we stop the crime, by making bad guys tell us where they live when they legally purchase their crime guns.)

There are ways around the AW ban. You can go featureless (with those dopey shark fin paddles behind the grip), or you can go mag lock. (There's a product from Juggernaut Tactical called the Hellfighter that allows you to break the upper and lower to prevent the gun going into battery so you can change the mag, while only adding about .3 sec to the change. *shrug* It's what we've got.) The mag lock route allows you to have all the other features of an AW - pistol grip, collapsible stock, flash suppressor, etc - but if you have something like a double-feed malfunction it essentially bricks the rifle from an I-need-to-shoot-a-bad-guy-in-my-living-room-right-now perspective.

What is interesting is that the Good Gun Roster is being challenged as a backdoor ban. They petitioned for cert at SCOTUS in December, but I don't think there has been any news since. If you take out approved guns that are really just a different version of some other approved 'base' gun (say, a black Springfield XD and one with an OD green frame), we only have regular access to about 1/3 of the handguns available for sale in the US. Sure, we can seek out some enterprising LEO who has purchased a S&W M&P 2.0 and is kindly offering it up for sale as a private party transfer for the completely reasonable price of $1,100. But generally, as time rolls on there are fewer and fewer handguns available as new here. Thanks to the all-powerful Roster, we are stuck at Gen3 Glocks, for example.

And let me save you some time on the snark-o-meter. I know my audience here, so you can spare me the "lol Cali" reply.

[Shyster]

lol Cali

[tifosi77]

Fair play.

[tifosi77]

I have been out of pocket all day, catching up with some old friends. (And, in 2019, I do mean old....)

Can someone - I don't know, maybe @Shyster - please break down the Remmington lawsuit in Connecticut? It seems like a novel (read: stupid) case theory that the rifle was wrongly marketed, and therefore the maker is liable for damages. Is there more to it than that?

Never mind the logic as applicable to these specific facts, this seems like a precariously slippery slope for product liability law.

[Shyster]

The Connecticut Supreme Court said that the lawsuit could go forward on the basis that Bushmaster's marketing and advertising somehow violated Connecticut’s Unfair Trade Practices Act (CUTPA). The 4-3 decison held held that CUTPA fit within the "predicate exception" to the federal Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act (PLCAA), which allows claims to be brought against a firearms defendant that knowingly violated a statute applicable to the sale or marketing of firearms and the violation was a proximate cause of the plaintiff’s harm. The majority held that CUTPA was a "statute applicable to the sale or marketing of firearms" because it prohibits such thing as false advertising, and the plaintiffs claim that Bushmaster engaged in "advertising and marketing the XM15-E2S in an unethical, oppressive, immoral, and unscrupulous manner that promoted illegal offensive use of the rifle."

As pointed out by the dissent, every other state and federal court that has examined the PLCAA "predicate exception" has held that when it refers to a statute "applicable to the sale or marketing of firearms," it means a statute that applies specifically to the sale or marketing of firearms, such as laws requiring background checks or prohibiting straw purchases. The majority's view that general trade-practices statutes fall under that exception would functionally gut PLCAA, because just about every state has laws that apply to such things as defective products or false or misleading advertising, and plaintiffs could just bring suits under those general state laws.

Because a question of federal law is involved, the defendants do have the opportunity to try to appeal this case to the US Supreme Court.

[tifosi77]

A federal district judge for the Southern District of California has just entered a final injunction barring California from enforcing its ban on firearm magazines that hold more than 10 rounds.

Here's David Kopel commenting on the decision at the Volokh Conspiracy:

https://reason.com/volokh/2019/03/29/di ... oins-calif

What is the practical meaning of this? When can I go to Turner's on Vanowen and get a 15-rnd mag?

[tifosi77]

Well, to answer my own question, it appears to be today. Woot.

Here's another question: Most of the stores i follow have announced they wil startl taking and fulfilling orders fror standard-capacity magas for both pistols and ARs. But under CA law, if you fix a 10+ mag to a mag-lock lower, it becomes an AW. (Not the case for a featureless build) Could this ruling be used to invalidate that section of the AW law?

[mac5155]

There was a thread on Palmetto state Armorys page where they said to let CA orders get priority haha. Enjoy more pew pews and less reloading, tif!

[Shyster]

It would be persuasive precedent, but not binding. District-court rulings are not binding precedent on any other courts (even the same district), so another federal judge in California could simply say, "I disagree with that decision." I'm also betting that the Ninth Circuit might enter a stay and stay the permanent injunction pending the appeal. Because that would totally be a Ninth Circuit thing to do. You can be sure the government is working on a stay application as we speak.

[tifosi77]

I mean, that's why people are sort of busting their bank accounts right now.

One YouTuber I follow made the joke that all of the standard-capacity owners who 'lost their mags in a boating accident' when the ban went into effect six or whatever years ago might want to go back to the lake and check the shoreline to see if their old stuff had maybe washed up on shore.

[mac5155]

I was given my great grandpa's double barrel 12 gauge today. It's in good condition for being 115 years old. Should I bother shooting it or just let it sit in the safe?

[tifosi77]

I'd put a couple shells through it.

My FIL has a Garand that will one day be mine (hopefully in the very distant future, if you get my meaning). I plan on putting exactly 8 rounds through it, *ting*, then into a safe.

[tifosi77]

Also, the injunction on the mag ban was stayed pending appeal. As of 5 pm today, we're back to the way it was last week.

Yay.

[Shyster]

I was given my great grandpa's double barrel 12 gauge today. It's in good condition for being 115 years old. Should I bother shooting it or just let it sit in the safe?

I'm certainly not an expert, but I've read enough to know that a lot of shotguns made around 1900 or earlier had barrels made using steel alloys and construction methods that can be much weaker than modern guns. I think "Damascus" barrels might be some of the problematic ones. I'd do some research on the specific model of gun to see if it's considered safe to shoot, and if there's any question about whether it has barrels like that I'd take it to a gunsmith for a look-over.

[mac5155]

I was given my great grandpa's double barrel 12 gauge today. It's in good condition for being 115 years old. Should I bother shooting it or just let it sit in the safe?

I'm certainly not an expert, but I've read enough to know that a lot of shotguns made around 1900 or earlier had barrels made using steel alloys and construction methods that can be much weaker than modern guns. I think "Damascus" barrels might be some of the problematic ones. I'd do some research on the specific model of gun to see if it's considered safe to shoot, and if there's any question about whether it has barrels like that I'd take it to a gunsmith for a look-over.

After looking at a few pictures of damascus steel, it definitely is that. Into the safe she goes...

[tifosi77]

Yesterday was the first day of the Planes of Fame airshow out in Chino, which is my favorite event of the summer. So much history. Anyway, one of the highlights every year is the slew of WW2 reenactors that are all around the field, with a camp set up in which you can examine old equipment and such from many different armies. (Yesterday was heavy on American, British, and German - the theme of the show was commemorating the 75th anniversary of D-Day - and in the past they've had a lot or Russian and Japanese stuff, too.) When I went in, they had a lot of firearms out on display with clear "DO NOT TOUCH" signs all over the place.........................

......................................... if you were to set an over/under for the number of times in a five minute span some knucklehead picked up an M1 or BAR or Grease Gun and muzzled me with it as they twisted themselves into selfie mode, would you think 20+ would be accurate? Because it would be.

Mind you, these weapons are live, in that they can at least fire blanks. (They reenact a battle during the show, after doing an airborne paratroop drop, which was very very cool.)

[Morkle]

People having a lack of awareness and not respecting other people's wishes is one of my biggest grinds my gears things. See this all the time when people put their hands on cars at antique car shows, when they clearly say "do not touch" in their windshield.

[dodint]

State legislator has proposed making concealed carry permissive without a permit. Which is amusing because it is already incredibly easy to get a concealed permit in PA; no training requirement or need to demonstrate proficiency like I had to in NC, just a background check.

https://www.poconorecord.com/news/20190 ... rry-permit

[mac5155]

Still have to go to a courthouse between like 8-4......... which sucks for anyone who isn't a lawyer

[dodint]

My guess is the police unions will lobby and get this tossed. They really like to know, when making a stop, whether the driver has a CCW. My wife, a tiny thing that must appear very threatening to Ole Smokey, gets asked if she is carrying because she had a CCW three state residencies ago. Neither of us bothered to get a PA CCW when we settled back here.

[mac5155]

I'll never forget the look of sheer terror I got from the market district employee as I flashed my CCW (mistakenly) to buy alcohol. Some people's kids, man.