Thread of legal hubbub

dodint
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Thread of legal hubbub

Postby dodint » Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:51 pm

Georgia Court of Appeals judge is nominated to the Supreme Court of Georgia and he declines: https://twitter.com/JudgeDillard/status ... 4835918848

Neat.

Shyster
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Postby Shyster » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:14 pm

Wow. That's not the sort of promotion that many would turn down.

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:25 pm

That letter reads like, "This seems like a lot more work than I really want to take on."

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Postby Shyster » Thu Aug 16, 2018 3:18 pm

So far as we know, the Seventh Circuit just became the first federal appellate court to include a poop emoji in a published opinion. It appeared in a quoted Facebook post:

https://abovethelaw.com/2018/08/the-fir ... nion/?rf=1

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Postby Shyster » Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:30 pm

Motion to Continue Because of Moose Attack
https://loweringthebar.net/2018/08/moti ... ttack.html

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Postby dodint » Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:10 pm

Saw this CLE, immediately thought of tif: http://rocknrolllaw.com/
An overview of basic music copyright law in this digital age, including what is a copyright, how to get one, and the exclusive rights you get with a copyright, along with the cash streams they generate. Plus, we discuss copyright infringement cases, and end with an hour of ethics regarding the ethical dilemmas in representing a band. All of this is discussed through following Bruce Springsteen's career (ethics focuses on The Beatles).

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:21 pm

Ha, I've done copyright CLE in the past. Such hoots to be had.

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Postby Shyster » Wed Oct 03, 2018 4:54 pm

Very important legal question accepted for review by the PA Supreme Court today. The appeal is Commonwealth v. Davis, 169 MAL 2018, and the question certified is:
May [Petitioner] be compelled to disclose orally the memorized password
to a computer over his invocation of privilege under the Fifth Amendment to
the Constitution of the United States, and Article I, Section 9 of the
Pennsylvania Constitution?
This will be an interesting case to watch, as well as an important case when it comes to the privacy of electronic devices in the Commonwealth.

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Postby dodint » Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:01 pm

That is the central issue issue of my Long Paper. My adviser doesn't think there is much teeth to the 5A question so this will certainly help. Thank you!

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Postby dodint » Fri Oct 05, 2018 11:26 pm

When do you reckon this will actually be heard and subsequently decided/published?

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Postby Shyster » Sat Oct 06, 2018 12:51 am

It was just granted, so I wouldn't expect briefing and argument to be finished earlier than, say, 90 to 120 days, and the decision would take probably another three or four months at least, and it could be longer. My guess is late summer to fall of 2019 for an opinion

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Postby tifosi77 » Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:12 pm

What are the facts surrounding the, what's the phrase, attempted compulsion to disclose the password?

Generally speaking, most of the law surrounding privacy is still stuck in a 18th century mentality. Applying that to 21st century technology is tricksy.

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Postby dodint » Sat Oct 06, 2018 2:23 pm

The big catch that I've been presented with is that you can't plead the Fifth during an investigation, only once you're criminally charged. You can be compelled to provide a password prior to being charged and then the evidence gained may be used against you later at trial. Presumably you have the right to remain silent, but investigators have gotten injunctions from courts to compel someone to divulge device passwords and that's the undecided law creating conflict in this area.

The fact that this password is being requested orally is great for the defendant. Biometric mechanisms do not enjoy the same heightened cloak of protection.

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Postby Shyster » Sat Oct 06, 2018 5:40 pm

The Superior Court opinion is here:

https://law.justia.com/cases/pennsylvan ... -2016.html

It looks like the trial court and Superior Court both held that the defendant could be compelled to provide the password largely on the "foregone conclusion" doctrine, which basically says that when the testimony sought to be compelled is a foregone conclusion, the Fifth Amendment privilege no longer applies.

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Postby dodint » Sat Oct 06, 2018 6:06 pm

Except that the scope is far too narrow to cover all outcomes. Everyone in the room, thanks to defendants utterances, may know that badfile.mov is on there and that's a foregone conclusion; but there may be 100s or 1000s of other bad files on the machine that the investigators do not know about at this time. Providing the password isn't a key to open a safe containing badfile.mov; it's a key to open a safe containing [nobody knows]. It's one of the foundational concepts of my research.

In reading that opinion it looks like some cognitive dissonance is in play. If it's a foregone conclusion, why compel him to open the computer at all? They seem to have relied way too heavily on that Stahl case to declare the password non-testimonial. All it does is describe what a password is but doesn't consider the implication of divulging it. Silly.

It is a pretty good test case though. A guy who doesn't use wifi and lives alone who also testified that nobody else can use the computer is about as ironclad as you can get if you want to deploy this foregone conclusion nonsense.

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Postby Shyster » Sat Oct 06, 2018 9:34 pm

I share your view of the foregone-conclusion doctrine. Allowing the government to basically say "we already know you're guilty" is highly problematic when the government does not know and cannot know the entire contents of the device in question. For example, let's say that not only is their child porn on that hard drive, but it also contains a video of the defendant committing some other crime, such as a video where the defendant personally had sex with a child or committed a murder. The government has no idea that the defendant committed that other crime. Once they see the video, however, they're sure as heck going to charge that additional crime. Forcing the defendant to provide the password is essentially the same as forcing the defendant to testify as to any other potential crime that the defendant might have committed, which to me runs counter to the entire point of the incrimination clause of the Fifth Amendment.

I also agree the facts of the particular case aren't great. That defendant obviously never learned to keep his mouth shut when talking to the police.

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Postby Tomas » Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:58 pm

@dodint : since you were writing paper on the related topic. Note the last sentence - only 12 years! :scared:

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... edit-text=

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Postby dodint » Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:04 pm

Yeah, that seems...low.

Poor Jared.

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Postby Tomas » Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:39 am

Because I am 99% sure this will forever be my one and only foray into the world of law, here is my overplayed touchdown dance:

Boooyah!
Harvard. What? Like it is hard?
https://blogs.harvard.edu/bankruptcyrou ... overnance/

Konichiwa, b&^*#s! :twisted:

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Postby willeyeam » Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:45 am

Awesome man, congrats

tifosi77
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Postby tifosi77 » Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:50 am

That's actually pretty neat, well done.

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Thread of legal hubbub

Postby crusherstasiak » Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:50 am

That's actually pretty neat, well done.
dude is a boss, tif
https://news.uark.edu/articles/41518/wa ... ng-faculty

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Thread of legal hubbub

Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:13 am

I'm subpoenaed to court tomorrow as a witness for Westmoreland County. Only took 3 years to get the criminal files charged...

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Postby Lemon Berry Lobster » Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:09 pm

Al Lindsay, what a weird guy.

dodint
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Postby dodint » Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:04 pm

Made a passing reference to Shyster in a reflective essay for school today. I said if I ever do practice law I will take the advice of a local attorney I know and enroll in a Bryan Garner seminar.

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