2017-2018 Pittsburgh Pirates Off-Season Thread

Postby **NailedPenguin** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:22 pm

I dont think the issue is them giving up on 2018

Postby **MrKennethTKangaroo** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:22 pm

I’m not sure why anyone would think that cutch would garner more of a return at the 2018 deadline than right now. Plus cutch was going to be a sulk around this season anyways.

Postby **Viva la Ben** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:23 pm

I side with madden on this one. Not sure why everyone is so pissed off and why everyone is accusing the pirates of a salary dump. Will they have to pay his 2018 salary? No. But we all know he was an FA after this season.

And we all know that this 2018 wasn’t going to amount to diddly poo with muccuten and cole. So it should come to no surprise.

And it should come to no surprise that we aren’t getting a king’s ransom in return for a 31 year old with a —0.7 WAR season and 2.5 WAR season in 2016 and 2017.

If anyone wants to whine about cheapness, whine about the 2016 offseason when they decided to let happ walk and made no tangible improvements to the team. That offseason set this team up for two wasted seasons.

It will be far more than two wasted seasons Kenneth

Postby **willeyeam** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:26 pm

regardless of if the move was right/wrong and the timing of it, this Bryan Reynolds fella intrigues me a bit

Postby **willeyeam** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:26 pm

They aren't gonna get much for a year of Cutch and it'll probably get ugly

Postby **slappybrown** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:28 pm

I’m not sure why anyone would think that cutch would garner more of a return at the 2018 deadline than right now. Plus cutch was going to be a sulk around this season anyways.

What if he's hot?

Is this deal they made today not one they could have had whenever they wanted? Bc it seems that way. They decided they'd rather save 6-9mm depending on when you move him midseason.

Postby **MrKennethTKangaroo** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:30 pm

It will be far more than two wasted seasons Kenneth

If you are referring to 2018 and beyond being wasted seasons, I disagree. 2018 and beyond have always hinged on the success of bell glasnow kingham taillon and Austin meadows. So far the plan for 2018 and beyond isn’t looking very good. But no reasonable person should expect the pirates to sign cutch or cole for long term deals. So if 2018 and beyond will be a waste, it has everything to do with the failures of these young guys.

Postby **willeyeam** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:31 pm

https://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/statu ... 7062288384

Postby **skullman80** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:33 pm

I honestly don't know how anyone could buy a ticket to go fund this mess this year.

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:34 pm

Sources: #Pirates signing LH closer Felipe Rivero to four-year contract with two club options. Guarantee believed to be about $22M, with each club option $10M. Deal will cover all four arb years and potentially two FA years. Not clear if an agency was involved in negotiations.

Postby **MrKennethTKangaroo** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:35 pm

I’m not sure why anyone would think that cutch would garner more of a return at the 2018 deadline than right now. Plus cutch was going to be a sulk around this season anyways.
What if he's hot?

Is this deal they made today not one they could have had whenever they wanted? Bc it seems that way. They decided they'd rather save 6-9mm depending on when you move him midseason.

In 4 out of his last 12 months of playing baseball, cutch has exceeded his career OPS. The rest of the time he has been garbage.

Postby **columbia** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:38 pm

A lot happened since I last looked.

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:39 pm

https://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/statu ... 7062288384

He's gotta be regretting that decision.

Edit:

Maybe that's what he meant with this one

https://twitter.com/Rivero43/status/953020399511638019

Postby **columbia** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:40 pm

Cuth return is example of running the team in the worst possible way: selling low on top assets and refusing to spend money when top assets were playing at their peak.

Postby **slappybrown** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:41 pm

I’m not sure why anyone would think that cutch would garner more of a return at the 2018 deadline than right now. Plus cutch was going to be a sulk around this season anyways.
What if he's hot?

Is this deal they made today not one they could have had whenever they wanted? Bc it seems that way. They decided they'd rather save 6-9mm depending on when you move him midseason.
In 4 out of his last 12 months of playing baseball, cutch has exceeded his career OPS. The rest of the time he has been garbage.

Again, you can make this deals equivalent whenever you want right? What if the first four months of this season arenhim exceeding his career OPS? If he doesn't and he stinks in May, you can't get this deal then? But, if he looks good, maybe you have a sellers market and can get a real prospect. Just don't see how you can look at as anything other than a decision to prioritize 6 or 7 or 8 mm over the potential to make a deal that makes a difference. That's a worse spot than I thought they were in as a franchise imo.

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:47 pm

There is a rumor floating around Twitter that the Pirates maybe the first team to go all in on what has been a trend towards bullpenning full-time.

In other words getting out of the five-man rotation business and going towards a pitching system which sees guys go two or three innings rather than 6 or 7 and then a third here in the third there.

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:04 pm

Having zero good pitchers would be a bold and cheap endeavor.

Postby **Tico Rick** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:05 pm

Baseball sucks.

That's why I stopped watching baseball in 1992.

Postby **willeyeam** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:14 pm

Bucs paying a portion of Cutch's salary this year. Yeesh

Postby **Freddy Rumsen** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:20 pm

Yeesh

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:25 pm

Wow. Huntington is like Mike Milbury bad.

Postby **columbia** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:34 pm

$2.5M to be exact.

Postby **Morkle** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:35 pm

this is a fire sale plain and simple.
This IS a fire sale

Not sure why anyone has a problem with a fire sale. THe 2018 team is going to be awful, but it wasn’t going to be any good anyways.

The assumption here is that the expectation is to be good again.

I bet it takes 10-20 years.

Postby **columbia** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:37 pm

The Pirates are like a guy, who resigns from his job a week after he was fired.

Poor situational awareness.

Postby **Morkle** » Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:37 pm

Lol and they owe money so so good.