Off Season Moves Thread

Postby **columbia** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:03 pm

How many dollars and years are in an everything?

Postby **Rocco** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:04 pm

I don't see the point in keeping around Martin when the one thing the Pens have in their farm system is defensemen.

Postby **cadams** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:10 pm

Martin would need to take a paycut AND Scuderi needs to go. I would be OK spending $5 million total right now which would be moving Scuderi, retaining half his salary and Martin gets the difference over three years. So basically 3 years, $10 million but combined with Scuderi a cap hit of still around $5 million for the first two years.

Postby **Kicksave** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:14 pm

I think it would behoove this team to have at least one veteran guy on defense, whether that is Scuderi in a bottom pair role or Martin retained in a top-4 role.

Postby **Gaucho** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:19 pm

Well, there' s Lovejoy ...

Postby **No Look Drop Pass** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:20 pm

Friedman is throwing out Hudler as a Penguins target, possibly for Sutter. Not 1 for 1, just the main pieces.

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:21 pm

I think it would behoove this team to have at least one veteran guy on defense, whether that is Scuderi in a bottom pair role or Martin retained in a top-4 role.

Kris Letang is 28 years old and has played almost 500 regular season games in his career. That's veteran enough for me.

Postby **columbia** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:22 pm

It certainly wouldn't be shocking for Calgary to be interested in Sutter.

YouTube · Postby **mikey** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:22 pm

Hudler is probably the slowest skill player in the NHL...and is coming off of a big year, there's no reason to buy high on him...not that I think he would do poorly here necessarily, but it's just not good asset management...what little assets we have...

Postby **No Look Drop Pass** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:25 pm

Hudler is probably the slowest skill player in the NHL...and is coming off of a big year, there's no reason to buy high on him...not that I think he would do poorly here necessarily, but it's just not good asset management...what little assets we have...

I'm kind of in the same line of thinking. Goes against what GMJR said about his desires for a faster, better skating team next season.

Postby **meow** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:31 pm

How many dollars and years are in an everything?

Many and several

Postby **large garlic** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:31 pm

I'd like to bring Martin back or to have some other capable top-4 guy brought in. As it stands, the top two pairings would be something like

Maatta-Letang
Pouliot-Cole

Maatta and Letang both are question marks due to health issues. Pouliot and Cole both showed potential to be solid top-4 d-men, but I thought Pouliot regressed prior to his injury, and Cole really doesn't have a track-record in that role. Adding another top-4 guy would give Cole a more reliable partner to hopefully ease his growth into being a legit top-4 guy himself and would allow Pouliot to get more sheltered minutes on the 3rd pairing. If Scuderi is moved and Martin is re-signed at his current $5 million cap hit, the salary hit isn't too bad.

All that said, I'd only go 2 years/$10 million for Martin. The Pens just need reliable cover for a year or two until Pouliot, Dumoulin, and Harrington can assume bigger roles. I'd assume Martin could get something like 5 years/$25-30 million in free agency, and the Pens shouldn't offer that. He'd have to REALLY want to come back to the Pens for things to work out.

Postby **meow** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:33 pm

I don't see the point in keeping around Martin when the one thing the Pens have in their farm system is defensemen.

None project to be the minute muncher that Martin is. The fact that he can play over a period of low maintenance, heavy-lifting minutes is a big deal with some many young guns potentially roaming the blue line.

YouTube · Postby **mikey** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:35 pm

Harrington could be down the line...but that won't be this year in all likelihood of course...

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:36 pm

If they bring back Martin, then in my opinion it's time for GMJR to sack up and saddle up and use Maatta or Pouliot as trade bait.

Postby **Avyran** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:40 pm

So right now we have...

Top 6 = Crosby, Malkin, Perron, Hornqvist
Fringe / Question Marks = Dupuis, Kunitz, Bennett, Plotnikov?
3rd/4th line = Sutter, Spaling
Fringe / Youth = Sundqvist, Rust, Wilson

(By "fringe" I mean possibly capable of playing in top 6, but more likely to be in 3rd line... though I think Plotnikov deserves a real shot with Malkin, considering we probably won't find anyone in FA. I mean, he has experience playing with folks like Ovechkin already. Also not including anyone from free agency like Comeau who I think we'll be bringing back.)

Top 4 Defense = Letang, Maatta
Fringe = Cole, Pouliot
Bottom 2 = Lovejoy, Scuderi, Dumoulin (no longer safe from waivers)
Fringe / Youth = Harrington

Does this look right? I think Cole solidifies his spot as a top 4 d-man on this team this year, but I'm still hesitant to proclaim him as one already.

In the short term, Martin makes for a much stronger second (or even first) pairing, whether he's with Cole or Pouliot or whoever. However, part of me would rather not re-sign Martin (he'll want a final, lengthy contract, I'm guessing) and instead deal with the growing pains this year. It's going to have to happen at some point. Martin's contract could potentially become a problem down the road, though I do think his game allows him to age pretty well in the NHL (like Streit).

Postby **meow** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:42 pm

I see Dumoulin starting the season in another organization.

Postby **Craig** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:46 pm

I dont see anything from pouliot that says top 4 at this time. If the game is close late id add an extension to the bench to get him further out of my sight. I have hope he could develop some idea of how to play in his own end but unless there were huge strides made this summer hes nowhere near it now.

Postby **thehockeyguru** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:48 pm

Pens should do everything possible to retain Martin's services.

Depends on the term.

Postby **meow** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:48 pm

I dont see anything from pouliot that says top 4 at this time. If the game is close late id add an extension to the bench to get him further out of my sight. I have hope he could develop some idea of how to play in his own end but unless there were huge strides made this summer hes nowhere near it now.

While I agree, his defensive game has made considerable strides in the right direction, which leads me to believe he is capable of being good defensively, but he is not there yet.

Postby **Gaucho** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:48 pm

If they bring back Martin, then in my opinion it's time for GMJR to sack up and saddle up and use Maatta or Pouliot as trade bait.

How so?

Postby **Defence21** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:53 pm

I don't see the point in keeping around Martin when the one thing the Pens have in their farm system is defensemen.
None project to be the minute muncher that Martin is. The fact that he can play over a period of low maintenance, heavy-lifting minutes is a big deal with some many young guns potentially roaming the blue line.

I get that, but Letang is a minute-muncher and Maatta could be as well. Of course, both have injury histories, but at some point, you have to let the kids play. If Martin is brought back, and I view that as a big if, they MUST get rid of Scuderi and maybe even Lovejoy. With Letang, Martin, Maatta, and Cole, the team would be making room for no more than two new defensemen. If Scuderi and/or Lovejoy remain in the mix, it's even fewer. This team is old and stale, so, in my opinion, the more non-core guys that leave, the better.

Postby **Avyran** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:54 pm

I see Dumoulin starting the season in another organization.

I think he could possibly bring back a 2nd pick... definitely a 3rd.

Postby **Kicksave** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 12:58 pm

Source of the post With Letang, Martin, Maatta, and Cole, the team would be making room for no more than two new defensemen.

You don't consider Cole a new defensemen?

Postby **Dickie Dunn** » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:12 pm

If they bring back Martin, then in my opinion it's time for GMJR to sack up and saddle up and use Maatta or Pouliot as trade bait.
How so?

Trade from a position of strength to improve a position of weakness. Sutter as trade bait can apparently get you the Jiri Hudlers of the world and opens up a gapping hole on the 3rd line. I want better and younger or at the very least equivalent, younger, and more potential. If you re-sign Martin and continue to block the young defenseman, might as well use one of them for something other than Rob Kilnkhammer.

I like him and think he has great potential as an offensive defenseman, but if Martin is re-signed I would definitely look to deal Pouliot. He's still a defensive liability, is unlikely to see time outside the bottom pairing and power play, and might never be able to shoulder the rigors of top pairing minutes. Sure you'd be giving up potential, but you've got to give to get and if a 1st round draft pick can get you David Perron, what could Pouliot get you? If you deal him the defense still has Letang, Martin, Cole, Maatta, Lovejoy, Scuderi (please no), Dumoulin, Harrington, Swedish Guy, D'Agostino, etc.

I think its an option worth exploring, if and only if Martin is re-signed.